Reader PA wrote:
I’d love to see someone create a series of ten face-shots that represent women on each of the points of the 1-10 scale. Pics of celebrities, random women from the internet, etc.
I agree. So here’s a series of ten women representing, in my judgement, each point on the 1 – 10 looks scale. I’ve selected random girls from the internet and from the files*, as well as some celebrities, and stayed within the same race and fertile age range to keep it simplified. I’ve also avoided obese women, as fat will destroy even a 10′s facial beauty, and self-inflicted ugliness should not count towards any ranking of genetic female traits.
I’ve included a voting poll underneath each photo. Choose 1 through 10 for the candidates, making sure each number on the scale is used once (i.e. Do not vote 8 twice. There is enough gradation in the pics I’ve chosen that you should have no trouble assigning a unique ranking to every woman.) You can then compare your taste in women to the rest of the readers, and tomorrow I will put up my scores so you can see how your taste compares to mine (exquisitely refined, to say the least). The photos are in no particular order. David Alexander’s votes will be tabulated separately.
The idea is to see just how objective female beauty is for men, and if there is noticeable divergence in agreement on a particular woman’s ranking at different points on the scale. For example, do men have a harder time agreeing on what constitutes a 3, or a 9? I suspect there will be widespread agreement near the top and at the very bottom, and a little more wiggle room in the middle where most women bunch up. I also predict major dissension in the voting community over which woman qualifies as a 10 — perfection in female beauty.
Isn’t diversity wonderful?
*PS: There’s an Easter egg in this post. Those who know me in real life will be able to find it.
It’s funny (or maybe just I am). Except for the redneck cow, Frances McDormand is clearly the least “pretty” of the women pictured. Yet of all the women here, she is the one I find sexiest. I love that intelligent, focused look in her eyes. Plus her body ain’t bad. (See LAUREL CANYON.) I find the other, more conventionally attractive women mostly vapid-looking and therefore less interesting.
Who are these people marking the first pic as a 7?? I mean, I guess it’s possible that she’s a 7 if she isn’t bending over with a retarded smile, but still…
ignoring the small n and selection bias of the respondents, I think the results are pretty conclusive – female beauty is an objective standard for men (assuming all respondents are men).
There’s just no way around the fact that each response is skewed so heavily to one or two votes. These aren’t normal voting patterns by any stretch. the respondents have spoken and clear preferences emerge. the characteristics shared by the more attractive and less attractive women are also pretty striking.
this makes sense. men prefer visual stimuli, respond to only certain stimuli (i.e. heteros only enjoy straight porn, homosexuals are only turned on by gay porn), and in general more comfortable with hierarchies.
to the proto-feminists out there: sour grapes.
Well, there is some variability. I thought #7 was the nicest looking but the most common view was that #9 was. But it is true that opinions varied more at the top of the scale than at the bottom of it.
Still it is annoying that these tests are so routinely successful.
One of the issues with this is the more modelly style pictures are going to make girls look better. The best rated pictures are not candid, they are well lit pictures that fill the frame and are better as photos meant specifically to flatter the subject not to record the circumstances of the photo. I think the a,f, and j would move up if shot in a similar style.
Ditto to what Gunner said. The girl on the bridge with the red scarf is probably punching the most above her weight class. Compare her to the other girl on the bridge in sunglasses which is a much more of a candid shot. Hard to tell who’d look better if they were both shot the same way.
I will take the liberty of changing the question to : How well will each of these women age? Which will likely look wonderful at age 45?
a) shinny thick hair, dark eyebrows………will age well
b) thin eyebrows, thin lips, (despite the advantage of black/white photo) ………..will age poorly
c) thick eyebrows, hair, and lips……….will age well
d) thin hair, bags under eyes……….will age very poorly
e) thin eyebrows and lips, does failure to use hair conditioner correlate with failure to use sunscreen and moisturizer?………….will age poorly for lack of basic care
f) can not see eyes, medium strength hair…………can’t assess
g) great eyebrows (the best of the group), full lips, medium thickness hair……….will age well
h) glossy hair, pretty blue eyes, BUT she smokes and interestingly shows the hirsutism effect of obesity………will age very poorly
i) medium eyebrows, full lips, strong hair……….will age well
j) features too fussy to assess, but hair might be strong……………can not assess
Overweight and obesity take a toll on aging, but can not assess ones capacity to deal with obesity via photos.
My ratings were pretty much identical with everyone else’s.
Roissy, you will want to familiarize yourself with Arrow’s Impossibility Theorem before posting analysis.
We may need run-offs.
#9 Monica Bellucci is a living rebuke to those who say there are no true 10s out there. At least, she used to be.
#7 is Alizee, one of my favourite French performers. She doesn’t get the top spot only because she is competing with Monica Bellucci. Here is Alizee in HD:
Those eyes . . .
I had a hard time choosing an 8,9,and 10 from the three obviously hot ones…ended up choosing “g” for the 10 spot because that’s who i’d be most attracted to. Looks like my tastes are a little different from the majority since most people rated her 8.
I agree that beauty is objective to a great degree – much more than the girls on the lower end of this scale probably want it to be. There’s also a good deal of wiggle room for personal preference though – we are also programmed to be attracted to those who are genetically different from us, so it would make sense that not all men would agree on what a 10 is since they may subtly detect different levels of genetic variation from her.
Of course, for instance, fat isn’t REALLY genetic so no one is really attracted to fat people through this mechanism. Most things we consider attractive (are now/were in our evolutionary past) signs of health so we shouldn’t be surprised we look for those things objectively.
Is commenting OK? (There are probably more pictures available of the more famous faces, but I rated only by the pictures shown here.)
a, yentaattack2) Her freakish expression is dragging her down, badly. 5.
b, frances) Droopy. What is this chin condition (“mouse-muff” in my native tongue) called in English? 2.
c, smarceau) What a cutie — easily the hottest. An adorable combination of baby-fat and the softest jawline. I feel a bit bad about the ten, since the photo conditions are perfect. 10.
d, redheadk) Very average, but still kinda cutesy. 6.
e, amgirl1) Low-tier. 3.
f, aygirl) Looks nice despite the low resolution. (Interesting how the facial beauty seems somewhat deducible from body features.) 8.
g, alizee) I’m very strict when it comes to chins; her’s is a wee bit too strong to my taste. 7.
h, cigstache) LOL. 1.
i, monica) Monica is near-perfection, but a bit behind the cutie that is girl c). 9.
j, ngirl) Similar to girl f), facial beauty has to be deduced from the body. 4.
My fear of uggos is so great that I was physically cringing as I went down the pics, knowing you had some awful ones waiting. Cigstache did not disappoint.
One of the issues with this is the more modelly style pictures are going to make girls look better.
The modelly pictures dramatically improve Sophie Marceau’s looks, but dampen down Alizee’s.
With a 10 though it doesn’t seem to much matter. Here is a more “candid” picture of Monica Bellucci:
http://www.tccandler.com/IMAGES/actresses/MonicaBellucci/monica%20bellucci%20smile%20black%20prem.jpg
I think she looks even better than in the shot Roissy picked.
The order of beauty goes like this: 5, 3, 8, 6, 2, 7, 9, 1, 10, 4. With the 8 and 9 girls possibly swappable.
Granted, Roissy may have included McDormand and Bellucci as red herrings to illustrate the marginal effect of status value, but that’s debatable.
As flawed as this little exercise is, its also pretty instructive. An only truly objective way to gauge facial beauty like this would be to use photos that normalize for scale, neutral expression, omission of body and hairstyle, and professional grade of photograph. But barring that, this ain’t bad.
It would be interesting to apply this to the less-granulated domain of male facial aesthetics.
I agree with a lot of what it is said on this blog, but the claim that female beauty is objectively quantifiable is just not something that has ever borne out in my experience. Like most men, I’ve had LOTS of conversations about how attractive woman X is, or what makes women in general attractive, and with exception to the 1-3 range (but NOT, however, the 8-10 range) I’ve seen WIDE variability. Just my experience.
And at this point (though it is early in the game) the results are, for the most part, indicating that there IS, in fact variability. In the first 5 pictures, for example, we see fairly even division across three to five different gradients.
Seeking Alpha: I voted the first woman a 7. Though her face is a probably always intense, I figured that that was probably a particularly unflattering picture, and her body seemed pretty solid. And I like dark skinned, Italian looking woman.
I’m surprised with how many people voted the second to last woman a 10. I voted her an 8. Her body is probably incredible, but her facial features seemed decidedly more plain and less sexy than woman #7 and woman #3.
One last thing: on the whole this an excellent, diverse sampling, but I think the last picture is quite ambiguous. The chick seems to have good body, but from the way she’s bending over, it is hard to determine the frumpiness/tightness level. The high heels are also a bit deceiving, as probably make her legs look better than they normally look (though it is difficult to tell). Finally, her face is really quite obscured. Personally, facial beauty is probably the most important contributor to overall beauty, so without being able to get a good look at a woman’s face, I don’t feel entirely confident assigning her a rank.
Great post, very fun.
Also Aygirl pic is up at Harper’s Ferry, isn’t it? Along the rail bridge?
Good concept, but poor execution. You are comparing glamor shots with perfect lighting and lots of makeup with casual shots with poor lighting and no make up. For instance, #9 is wearing heavy foundation, which in combination with the lighting makes it impossible to tell what her skin actually looks like: certainly hugely important for a woman’s good looks. I agree that makeup doesn’t necessarily raise a woman’s score that much, but mixing the madeup (1, 3, 7, 9) with the makeup-less (2, 4, 5, 6?) is just negating the whole point of an objective beauty standard.
Why on earth are people voting for the 6th girl to be a freaking 7?? Look at her!
-She’s wearing flip-flops
-The rest of her getup is terrible
-She has absolutely *awful* hair, with what seems to be the remnants of some sort of perm or curling operation
-She’s wearing this dead, fake smile
-Sure she’s thin, but there is absolutely no muscle tone there. She looks like she’s never had any exercise in her life
I’d say she’s a 4.
I ranked C (Sophie Marceau?) as the 10, while it looks like most people gave that rank to I (Monica Bellucci). It’s close, however, and could go either way.
By the way, given that the conventional wisdom of the blogosphere is that women turn into foul skags after age 30,* it should be noted that Monica Bellucci is 44 years old.
* = 25, according to Agnostic; 20, according to Gannon.
Peter
There is probably a slight divergence in those photos between what I recognize as objective beauty vs. the specific women who strike me as most desireable.
For example, objectively, girl no. 3 is most beautiful, and that’s who I marked as a ten. She is the one with a closeup face shot, green eyes, and white fluffy sleeve. But she doesn’t fire up my engines, if you get my drift, other than being nice to look at.
The girl with the red scarf is cute but for some idiosyncratic reason I find her kinda gross.
The second-to-last girl (black dress with cleavage, long black hair) will probably be seen as hot and she does have soem classical markers of beauty, but she’s got too much of a jawline for me and lacks a feminine softness.
However, the girls that do a lot for me in those pics are the girl on the bridge (white shorts, sandals, tanktop, water bottle) and the one after that (short red hair, black tanktop). Even though I ranked other girls higher on the objective beauty scale, those two girls hit the sweet spot most nicely for me.
I’m especially into the bridge girl. She’s no ten, and I can’t make out her face too well, but the overall impression she makes is one of a nice girl with a lovely shyness to her whom I’d love to (uhm, work computer) more than any of the other ones.
The green-eyed readhead is smouldering, but probably not LTR material.
Note to Thursday: in the more casual picture link of #9 you provided, she is at a movie premiere or similar event, where she has been heavily made up by a professional makeup artist (probably took at least 2 hours). This is not a good comparison either.
I would guess that the “Easter egg” has something to do with the last girl, as the picture was taken on the DC Metro.
Peter
This is objective. I wanted to give number 8 a 9 just to mess things up, but some strange psychological block couldn’t bring me to press the button.
Last pic Woodland Park-National Zoo/Adams Morgan. Red Line.
Was this a pic just for this post? Otherwise I can’t see any reason to snap it.
(d) will have to be very careful about her skin and hair and may need some work later to take care of the eyebags and droop around the chin but I agree with what others have said. Definitely punching above her weight. So is (j). Dressing and accessorizing stylishly and watching her diet/working out (I expect) because she will really put on weight otherwise. In this regard, (j) and (f) are interesting contrasts, though for all I know girl-on-a-bridge can get modded up when she chooses to.
At my age (45), it truly saddens (and frustrates) me to see so many women who won’t take the simple expedient of controlling their weight and dressing well. Frances McDormand is an excellent inclusion here: mannish face, plain body, but she takes care of herself and flatters her good attributes with a sense of personal style.
Fun stuff roissy. Thanks.
smarceau, alize and monica are all 9+.
Water bottle and slouchy girl on a bench are both what I’d call 7′s. Atrractive, doable, but nothing to write home about. I’d be interested in seeing bench-girl with a full face shot and better posture though.
There are some questions that should be resolved before constructing a scale. Should we allocate each point on the scale to one decile of the female population? Or should we skew the rankings to obtain more precision at the top. How important is it really to distinguish between 3′s and 4′s? 7′s and 8′s on the other hand…
How about, ranking = log_x (beauty). Where beauty is a linear ranking of every woman in the world, and the subscript x is whatever we need to take the log of to make log_x (beauty) come out to 10 for the 4 billionth woman.
I would probably bang the ginger “5″ but i would be embarrassed.
Adjusting for our biases:
1. We all knew Belucci was on there (because we all scroll before voting) so we reserved the 10 for her; but I gave the redhead whose head is cut off slightly the 10 because I thought this was strictly about faces, and she’s got a great smile and unique symmetry. But then I like angular more than rounded, so I can see why she and Belucci, and possibly Marceau (also rounder) could get the top slot.
2. The obvious top 3 someone mentioned above are all celebrities AND these images are not “candids”. This doesn’t mean they are not the hottest, b/c they obviously are, but a certain amount of airbrushing/photoshopping could change the 3-7 rankings. For example, Jewish Tiara may not be hotter than Bridge girl if they’re both dolled up in party mode; cannot really tell what her normal face looks like based on this photo. Same with eurocheeks, she might gain points if photographed better. McDormand looks like she rides horses, plain and simple. Random, I know.
3. Red scarf is an anomaly. Even though the picture is clear, full frontal and in focus, she could be ugly or pretty, I cannot say for sure. I gave her a 5. She must be slavic. Their facial features are so different than what we are used to that it is hard to say if they are pretty or not sometimes.
Totally off topic, but what kinds of places in DC should I look for to pick up lonely unattached drunk chicks on the 14th?
Are there any age groups that are more vulnerable than others?
Any specific bar recommendations?
Help a brother out.
The Egg: Haven’t you used the picture of girl A in a previous post?
Two other scales that I like:
1) Two rankings – “Terrible” and “Not Terrible.” If she’s Not Terrible, it’s OK. This was popular on my rugby team.
2) Using a 10-point scale, a friend of mine drew a graph relating minimum hotness you would accept in a girl you were banging Vs. the probability of your friends finding out. As p(friends finding out) approaches zero, tolerance for warpiggishness asymptotically approaches 3.
Guys who draw graphs get laid like nobody’s business.
i could not agree more with the second commenter – who is giving the first chick a 7???
the girl on the bridge has a pretty big nose.
the redhead is adorable.
I voted and am not male, so ha! I went for what I thought was attractive, and my votes seem to be the same as others.. had a harder time deciding on the middle range, also thanks to the picture-taking quality.
ironrailsironweights:
For me, Alizee easily takes the first place, but then, as you say, Sophie Marceau and Monica Bellucci are much older. In any case, relative rankings of impressively beautiful women (8+) are purely subjective.
By the way, am I the only one who often finds carefully arranged and photoshopped modelling photographs as a turn-off? The picture of Sophie Marceau above looks pretty bad in this regard. Even Monica Bellucci looks somehow fake and lifeless in the above photo. It’s like looking at a cartoon.
I’m surprised, I thought #3 was the most beautiful, followed by monica. #7 is kinda eh. Maybe the doey eyes and the hair misled me…
It’d be interesting to see if people consistently over- or under-rate girls. I went under on some, over on others.
No cute young Japanese women? No ten from me. I’m in general agreement with the rankings, but a ten?
We’re talking Torville and Dean, the Americans beating the Soviets in hockey, for a ten. Not first prize at the county fair.
I only saw one girl: Monica Bellucci.
On another note:
Rick’s Cabaret in New Orleans in the most “user friendly” Gentleman’s Club in America.
It had some tough going after the Storm, but I can confirm that its back.
I guess you could say I got sucked in. (so to speak).
– MPM
Correction:
Rick’s Cabaret in New Orleans is the most “user friendly” Gentleman’s Club in America.
The 3 hottest are French (if you consider Monica Belluci as half French): you definitely have good taste in women.
Is D (red scarf/earbuds) a celebrity? She doesn’t look familiar, but the photo seems professionally posed.
A (tiara/Corona) and E (Amsterdam?) would look better if they had less dopey expressions on their faces, A especially. E also looks to be a bit up there in years, perhaps as old or older than Marceau and Bellucci.
Peter
What a maddening survey!
Three comments:
1. Although I chose Monica Bellucci as the 10, because of the model pose, hairstyle and shot, I think Alizee is actual perfection.
2. The pictures chosen illustrate how hard it is to find the elusive “7″s in real life. It was clear who the top three were and who the bottom 2 were. But the middle 5 were interchangeable.
Most guys are 5 to 8s and so we all want the 7.
8s are either too hard to get, already taken, or have attitudes.
5s are nondescript.
6s are barely acceptable but since men can date up while women can’t, the 7 is ideal. Pretty, but not so pretty to be unapproachable.
3. The pictures are Eurocentric and don’t represent the population or individual tastes accurately. You should ask for submissions from the readers to submit “10″s from each major racial group. Then, you should pick 3 representatives from each group and have the readers choose the most attractive. This would be interesting.
Man, the elusive “7″…
What’s everyone’s thing with Bellucci? I never understood the appeal, and yes, I saw her in a few movies. She’s too fleshy and jawly to be anywhere near a 10.
On the elusive 7, I bet ‘H’ (flip-flop girl) would be a 7 if she was anywhere except on vacation. People giving her crap for wearing flip-flops are being too hard. If she was at a bar or at work or something, it’d be bad, but she’s on vacation! That is definitely an acceptable time to wear flip-flops.
If she had her hair straightened with a flattening iron, put on make-up, and wore something nice to show off her tits, she’d definitely be a 7.
The ideal 7 is someone who is really a borderline 6/7 when she’s at her worst (like this pic), but can be made up to an 8.
Oh god! F is a 7, not H, haha. Definitely not H
Here’s an interesting question that is underneath all of the discussion of what is or is not a certain score. Is the distribution of women along the discrete scale a normal distribution (i.e. bell curve) or a uniform distribution? Is there a jumble of 4s,5,and 6s and just a few 1s and 10s? Or are 10% of women between a 9 and 10 or 1 and 2?
It doesn’t really matter which distribution is chosen, but for the sake of argument an international standard has to be developed. As for myself, I’ve contributed to this field of study through two previous blog posts:
http://chuckross.blogspot.com/2009/01/hotness-scale.html
http://chuckross.blogspot.com/2009/01/more-on-hotness-scale.html
Carl Sagan wrote:
“My ratings were pretty much identical with everyone else’s.”
Carl,
So were all of ours.
Thats the point, beauty really isn’t all that subjective at all. Its pretty measurable and we all see it and rate it within the same range.
Girl number 3# is absolutely beautiful. A true honey bunny.
Thursday,
“Here is Alizee in HD:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWUcIn1GGmE&feature=hd ”
Jeez, that girl is insane.
With dark hair she kills it. And she destroys Madonna on that track.
“The 3 hottest are French (if you consider Monica Belluci as half French): you definitely have good taste in women.”
No suprise there. French girls are illmatic.
I spent my early 20′s on the beach in France surfing and swooping mad fly topless girls in La Côte Basque.
I have done a lot since then, although sometimes I doubt I topped it.
– MPM
By the way, given that the conventional wisdom of the blogosphere is that women turn into foul skags after age 30,* it should be noted that Monica Bellucci is 44 years old.
Well, if you have the best bone structure in the world like Monica Bellucci then of course you can still look hot up through your early forties. But most women don’t have Monica Bellucci level bone structure now do they?
So, yes, women shouldn’t be concerned about the rapid decline in their looks past 30, and especially past 35. They shouldn’t worry. All they have to do is look like Monica Bellucci. It’s just that simple.
(It should also be noted that Bellucci looked noticably worse for wear in Shoot Em Up, the last picture I saw her in. Right now, she’s probably only a 7. Even for her, the wall draweth nigh . . .)
The 7th lady pictured doesn’t have the “stuff” that makes a 10 a 10. She’s a man eater, but she doesn’t have what the 3rd and 9th women have. Some men go for that type of lady, but just on looks she can’t compete.
By the way, the 3rd lady is the 10. If the 9th lady looked my way on the street I’d pop an eyebrow. But the 3rd lady wouldn’t have to look my way to cause me to melt.
#7 and #9 don’t have that “melt” effect
Oh, Monica…adding her in the mix is not even fair. She is not of this Earth.
What’s interesting, as de Tocqueville alluded to, is that while we don’t necessarily agree on the exact position for any particular woman, we all agree on the range. The bottom 3 (well, really bottom 1 and next 2) are quite clear, the top 3 are a quite clear, leaving the equally clear middle 4. I think it’s safe to say that any normal hetero man would bang the top 3, very few of us would bang the bottom 3 unless we were desperate and hammered, and the middle 4 would be various flavors of “it depends”.
These 3 tiers relate pretty clearly to the dating world. The top tier will attract alphas easily and ultimately be able to hold onto one. The middle tier will attract the occasional alpha, but not for very long, and will wind up with a beta. The bottom tier will attract no alphas, the occasional beta, and ultimately wind up with either cats or an omega (is there really any difference?).
Two interesting results:
– it is easy to guess the median of what other guys rate
– with exception of the obvious 5′s, the ratings are by no means normal distributed: the uglier the more leftwards the skew and the opposite if true for higher ranking chicks
– while some guys obviously take make-up etc. into account, you can see that others “fall for it” and rate these girls higher
– I could have easily detected the DC slut even if she wouldn’t have sat right next to the metro sign
This is dumb. By forcing a ranking (only one can be a 9, 8, etc) you aren’t measuring what people actually think of the models. Not to mention the myriad reasons why you can’t judge someone’s attractiveness from a poorly taken static photograph (or highly-photoshopped glamor shot). Most of these girls could be +/- 3 points in person.
However, the only reason I’m actually posting is because I want to take a guess at the easter egg: The guy behind the girl in the first picture is Roissy.
3. The pictures are Eurocentric and don’t represent the population or individual tastes accurately.
And south-euro-centric. For me, it’s extremely difficult to be 8-10 with brown eyes, especially for European-looking people.
For example, Alizee, although sexy dancing rules even if it’s entirely choreographed and rehearsed, gets 6-7 at most. Dark + southern euro face = many minus points. France doesn’t score very high at all for me.
It IS pretty subjective.
Alizee and Monica are the top two.
too many celebrities in here, ruins it. i just dont get off on the celebrities. shit, they’re hardly even human. maybe if i got a full frontal in-the-flesh it would be different, i dunno. but then i’m the sort of guy who would rather see amateurs than porn stars. it would have been better if it was just rank a bunch of real chicks.
w/r/t the real chicks here i dont think they are too bad on the average excepting of course the fat chick with the mustache (sadly, she probably sees more action than the regular average looking beta guy). i think chick A would be a fine one nighter but i doubt she has many redeeming personality characteristics, chick D is cute; photo is very well done, E isn’t terrible, i’d hit it, and i bet she would be down to smoke and that’s worth a shit load of points in my book, lol. chick J is kind of cute too, looks like she might have a little latin blood in her and thats always hot. girl F is mediocre, she looks too tall for my taste and flip flops are a turn off in any circumstance. its hard to tell, the photo and wardrobe are not flattering but i guess i wouldnt turn her down
“Is D (red scarf/earbuds) a celebrity? She doesn’t look familiar, but the photo seems professionally posed.”
She strongly resembles Lauren Ambrose from Six Feet Under.
Roissy was right – consistency on the ends, with more variability in the middle. I’m wondering if most people rated them the way I did, which was to work my way from the ends to the middle. It’s easier to pick out obvious beauty and obvious ugliness than to judge the shades of gray in between. In spite of all the inconsistencies in dress, body profile, makeup and lighting, it’s interesting how people’s answers all grouped around similar choices. If the women were “normalized”, i.e. all wearing the same clothing and makeup in the same room and all shots were full body, I wonder if the distributions of choice would tighten. Incidentally, this only proves that the Western men commenting here have similar ideas of beauty, NOT that appreciation of beauty is innately programed. On the high and low end of the scale, studies show that it is, but in between, upbringing and culture have the greatest effect.
Brilliant selection.
I realize this is strictly face, but how much does height matter to everyone here?
Would Alizee still be a 10 for some of you if you knew she was 5’3” ?
As for me, I’ll take a girl who is 5’10” with a face score of 8 over a 5’3” girl with a face score of 10 any day of the week.
Eventually some of you are going to have kids, and you don’t want your boys to be 5’8 do you?
“Looks fade, but genetics last forever”
– Original quote from me
since men can date up while women can’t
That’s generally true, but man I’ve seen some pairings that really had me scratching my head.
Come to think of it, what I actually have in mind are marriages where the wife is just way over-bought. I think rakes might marry plain because they don’t want their wives being seduced by other rakes.
So, Plain Jane marries Don Juan and he has affairs and she gets to raise the kids and be seen with him in public. Then she gets addicted to food and psych meds.
I saw a 9 shopping today.
a) 4
b) 6
c) 9
d) 7
e) 2
f) 5
g) 8
h) 1
i) 10
j) 3
However, the only reason I’m actually posting is because I want to take a guess at the easter egg: The guy behind the girl in the first picture is Roissy.
Heh, I thought the same thing.
“Here is Alizee in HD:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWUcIn1GGmE&feature=hd ”
Oh my God, that was too hott for words.
I’d do Alizee even if she were shaved. And that’s the biggest compliment I can ever make.
Peter
Genetics influence looks. And if your boy must be tall, remember that your daughter must be beautiful
jaakkeli:
It IS pretty subjective.
I’ve noticed that you seem to have really eccentric tastes in women.
Maybe it’s the face that Alizee is making in #7. I know she has a 10 body, but once she’s detached from it and making that grimace, she’s no longer as appealing.
Her face isn’t so stunning to make me go “wow!”, and she doesn’t strike a sultry pose as she often does while performing.
The look that #3 gives goes beyond her physical proportions, it’s the “stuff” of 10s.
Monica B. is 45 years old and no longer looks like that.
OT: If you trouts look like you could be a girls dad her friends will make fun of her (and you of course).
You guys are just as self-deluded as cougars (maybe worse).
Some funny stuff. I guess Alizee from that video is the pretty shot but rating her below a 9 seems foolish.
Dark, sultry and southern Europe as negatives, ah no.
And anyone rating Sophie Marceau and Monica Bellucci below 10 are frankly just kidding themselves. Even the former Pope said Monica is perfection.
It’s true the professional shots have too much advantage but this is a blog not Sports Illustrated.
Its hard for me to drink Alize (no doubt) I take a sip
Holy — I saw the Alizee video. She is now my 10. Sorry Monica, you had your time 20 years ago.
Yes, this is just horrible. This sexy dark brunette:
Help!
Bellucci and Marceau skew the entire distribution. Those ladies are 3 standard deviations from the mean in beauty. When you look better than women 10+ years younger than you, you’re in a different class all together. Since the French seem to be dominating the top spots, there is no harm in including Melissa Theuriau who is already in her 30s and she looks better than many 20 year olds.
Looks have subjective and objective aspects:
1. There is the amount pleasure experienced in the brain by the viewer. All personal experience is subjective and the same woman can produce different amounts of that pleasure in different men. However while there can be variation of up to about three points here, but, for reasons explained below, it is usually less than two.
2. There is what creates the most of #1 on average in most men. Whatever your subjective experience in looking at a woman, this average creates an objective value. That is what she is worth to other men looks wise and it is a serious handicap for your genes to give you tastes that diverge too much from the average. Good taste has replication value.
I’ve decided I want to age with this one:
She is so photogenic and boy is she rocking in a bikini. Don’t know if she can really sing. Who cares.
That Melissa Theuriau is very striking too.
Just watched the video. She looks ten times better with long, dark hair too.
“I spent my early 20’s on the beach in France surfing and swooping mad fly topless girls in La Côte Basque.”
No you didn’t. Now please STFU.
BTW, that phto you have in the survey roissy does not look at all like Alizee. Are you sure its her?
I enjoyed this post, even though it’s a subject that gives me fits of narcolepsy. I’ve never thought the 1-10 scale was very useful, and usually devolves into tedious quibbling about subjective matters that people seem to assume are objective. Notice how the greatest agreement (the least variance) is towards the ends of the scale. The greatest deviation in towards the middle.
I’ve got a McDormand fetish. You might not know it to look at her, but she’s a hellcat… T.I.G.E.R.
1 to 10 is a shitty scale. What is the difference between 9 and 10, or 9 and 8? And so on.
Also, I can think of several Asian women who are way more beautiful than anyone on that list. I don’t find any of the women on that list exceptionally attractive, and they don’t really interest me.
bkg
female beauty is an objective standard for men.
No it’s not.
toyko that’s because you’re a loser beta, and like most loser betas you only like Asian women
DF it looks like Alizee + Photoshop.
tokyojesus, agreed on the nonobjectiveness. I don’t find most Asian women attractive at all!
re: easter egg. i threw a couple of red herrings in the selection to lead everyone astray.
ms bitter:
OT: If you trouts
this is never going to catch on. it’s unfunny, unclever, and unsupportable. older men/younger woman pairings are not nearly as ridiculous as older women/younger men pairings.
df:
BTW, that photo you have in the survey roissy does not look at all like Alizee. Are you sure its her?
it’s her. i took it.
tokyobetafist:
No it’s not.
you must date fat chicks.
Alizee = 10
Marceu = 9, Monica = 8
I confess that knowing about Alizee before seeing that picture had an strong impact on her getting my 10. And her age, perfect pert body, nice voice, etc (whoops, I’m fawning now).
With unlimited resources, a study should do identical head-shots under same conditions, no makeup, and be unknown people of nearly the same age.
The order of the top 3 I predict will depend alot on voters’ preconceptions of these celebrities based on varied (non-facial) traits.
One of the things i’ve really changed my opinion on since starting the game is the attractiveness of teenage girls. They are simply more attractive than other girls. Before, I was too beta to realize this, and would label men in such relationships as ‘cradle snatchers’. But it’s just the truth. Youth beats older beauty most of the time.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1140694/David-Walliams-disappoints-laydees-leaves-party-young-girlfriend.html
The one redeeming quality about the DC slut machine is that she seems to show some moderate calf musculature. (The huge feet I could do without) My old lifting partner and I will always ask of each others’ women how big their calves are, to evaluate them as breeding stock for powerful legs. It wouldn’t knock Alizee off her ten spot, but judging by her midsection in the youtube clip, she’s got some fast-twitch lean muscle on that frame.
Sophie Marceau shouldn’t wear her hair like that. It’s bound to attract the wrong type of guy.
The easter egg is Roissy, cropped out behind the ashkenazi.
BTW there is a lot of hate on the 10 point scale in the PUA community. A lot of guys in that community are a little paranoid about being thought of as mysogynists. There is also the practical consideration that some men tend to psyche themselves out once they have labelled someone a 9 or a 10.
I think all the 10 point scale hate is bullshit. At the very least, it describes an objective reality in our minds. We are more attracted to some women than others and this level of attraction goes up like a thermometer. The 10 point scale is a good way to describe this rising level of attraction. For my part, anything that helps us accurately describe reality is a good thing.
Here is Rokker on gaming 9s and 10s:
http://sexloveandrokkerroll.blogspot.com/2008/05/how-to-game-really-hot-girls-do-9s-and.html
Do not vote 8 twice.
Oops.
But then again, not reading the instructions and going straight for the task is very alpha.
The easter egg is Roissy, cropped out behind the ashkenazi.
If that’s the case, then he has a pretty chubby face.
I know I am supposed to pick (i) as a 10, but she’s just not my type. That much makeup also signals that she is not as naturally beautiful as (c) or (g)
Are there any more recent pictures of Alizee? I’d like to see how she looks now. That video of her singing La isla bonita is OLD. I’m pretty sure that I jerked off to it years ago during my beta youth.
Bwahaha
toyko that’s because you’re a loser beta, and like most loser betas you only like Asian women
I’m not a beta, nor am I an alpha (I’m above such ridiculous categories and labels).
So, is there any reason in particular why you hate Asians, or is it just random?
roissy
you must date fat chicks.
Different people have different preferences, that’s a fact. IMDB users have voted The Shawshank Redemption as the best movie ever, but it’s not like everyone thinks it’s the best movie ever. What possible benefit can you derive from thinking that everyone has the same preferences?
They are simply more attractive than other girls.
Nah, early twenties girls are the most attractive. I believe even teen loving Agnostic put up some data to this effect, and my close study of the complete canon of the Victoria’s Secret Fashion Shows 2000-2008 shows confirms this. When the new crop of 18-19 year old girls show up each year, they are _not_ the hottest girls in the show and usually take 2 or 3 years to be able to compete with the top girls. Alessandra Ambrosio at 18 could not compete with Alessandra Ambrosio at 24.
The one area where teenagers really are the best is in their skin. It almost glows.
(BTW will somebody please tell Heidy Klum to retire from VS fashion show. You were fine in your day m’lady, but now it is time to pass the torch.)
I actually use a 100 point scale with women.
Similar to the wine scale:
95-100 Classic: a great wine
90-94 Outstanding: wine with superior character & style
85-89 Very good: wine with special qualities
80-84 Good: a solid, well-made wine
70-79 Average: drinkable wine that may have minor flaws
60-69 Below average: drinkable wine but not recommended
50-59 Poor: undrinkable wine, not recommended
– MPM
I’m not a beta, nor am I an alpha
Just pure loser.
Note: A score given as a range (such as 90 to 94) indicates a preliminary score, usually based on a wine barrel tasting.
– MPM
Also, (d) and (j), while clearly not in the upper eschelon, are intriguing. However, that might just be my greater beta training kicking in.
Alizee will also have to work really hard on keeping her weight down as she ages. She’s a chunky little thing. Not that I’d mind.
Thursday
Just pure loser.
Saying that someone is a loser because he likes Asian women is as arbitrary as saying that someone is a loser because it rained yesterday.
People like Bwahaha and Thursday become hysterical with rage if you mention anything related to Asia. There are lots of people like them. It’s weird.
tokyoanalfisted, where did I say I hated Asians? I’m just pointing out the obvious fact that loser betas like you “prefer” Asian women because you don’t have it in you to be successful with an attractive white woman. Same thing goes for the fat white chicks who “prefer” black men. Everybody knows it. Everybody sees it. Truth ain’t got nothing to do with hate.
Ok, so here’s a few more recent and less than perfect photos of Alizee:
http://scipnet.wmw.cc/alizee_since_2007/alipics_09/super-alizee.de_feb09_%20(47).jpg
http://scipnet.wmw.cc/alizee_since_2007/alipics_09/super-alizee.de_feb09_%20(45).jpg
http://scipnet.wmw.cc/alizee_since_2007/alipics_09/super-alizee.de_feb09_%20(42).jpg
http://scipnet.wmw.cc/alizee_since_2007/alipics_09/super-alizee.de_feb09_%20(34).JPG (ouch)
http://scipnet.wmw.cc/alizee_since_2007/alipics_09/super-alizee.de_feb09_%20(55).jpg (ouch again)
She looks good but she’s hardly a nine or a ten. I’d place her in the 7-8 range.
That picture seals it. Fantastic leg musculature. Hints of a quadriceps sweep. She’s my new impossible ideal.
People like Bwahaha and Thursday become hysterical with rage if you mention anything related to Asia.
Asia? Where did I comment on Asians?
Can you even read?
1. 1 – an example of why Jewish boys crave the schiksa.
2. 1 – Roger Mayweather if he became a White woman.
3. 5 – boyishly girlish. Blah.
4. 7+ very nice but it’s the well composed photo and her clothes that help a lot especially compared to the other candid shots.
5. 1 – Carrot Top after trading the roids for estrogen
6. 4 – regular girl in a very poor photo/crummy clothes etc.
7. 4 – I thought this was a tranny at first. Too boyish. I saw the video links, I don’t like her at all. Not womanly at all. But a very cute guy.
8. 1 – Artie Lange
9. 10 – although I have problems with other things about her values etc. Genetic superstar but very unappealing in other ways.
10. 2 – nice meaty legs if you like that but the lid is horrific. From the neck up I’m seeing Vinnie or Tony or Nick.
Of this group I only like #4 and #9.
Re: Asians,
If I wanted someone with the body of a 12-year-old boy, I’d date 12-year-old boys.
A “10″ is an “8″ who grasps my sense of humor.
If she’s grasping my cock, even a 7 gets an upgrade.
Oh, and those lippy black chicks here – when they use punctuation in between breaths…
Sorry Williard, if you don’t like (c) you are now officially gay.
SeaFighter FSF-1,
“No you didn’t. Now please STFU.”
Actually you didn’t.
Or if you did, you negative attitude would have got you nowhere.
– MPM
Thursday, the reason women shouldn’t worry about their declining looks isn’t because of celebrities or anyone else who maintains their beauty longer.
The reason women shouldn’t worry about it is that it’s going to happen to us all anyway. One may as well go with the flow of life and learn to value themselves for things other than their “fuckability”.
[blockquote]At the very least, it describes an objective reality in our minds.[/blockquote]
That’s a fairly succinct description of what it means for something to be subjective.
If I wanted someone with the body of a 12-year-old boy, I’d date 12-year-old boys.
Except then you might end up in prison and get ass-raped.
Peter
willard blazes new trails:
7. 4 – I thought this was a tranny at first.
anyone who would rate alizee a 4 is not to be taken seriously in matters of judging female beauty. your votes will now be tabulated in the junk pile along with david alexander’s.
btw, the instructions were to vote a unique rating for the women, using each point on the 1 – 10 scale only once. you’ve voted for four 1s. travesty.
That video of her singing La isla bonita is OLD. I’m pretty sure that I jerked off to it years ago during my beta youth.
I looked it up. The video was filmed in 2003 so that’s six years ago. I was 18, she was 19. Ah, the memories…
Nowadays – assuming that I’m in state and got a bit of social proof going, I can pick up chicks who are “Alizee-hot” on a semi-regular basis.
The reason women shouldn’t worry about it is that it’s going to happen to us all anyway.
women who worry about aging are more likely than apathetic women to take measures that would preserve their looks for as long as possible. it is in women’s interests to be concerned about the ravages of aging on their sexual market value, and we see quite clearly by the vast multibillion dollar beauty enhancement and anti-aging industries that women are indeed making the logical decision that the most important asset they bring to the table is their youthful beauty.
by their choices ye shall know them.
#8
Obviously the people who picked her as a 5 and up were kidding. But who are the 15 idiots that picked this utter and complete warpig a 2??? I’d castrate myself before I had sex with her.
That’s a fairly succinct description of what it means for something to be subjective
podunk – Use the “” signs instead of the [ and ] signs.
The easter egg’s easy to spot. The one with the cigarette is your mom.
One may as well go with the flow of life and learn to value themselves for things other than their “fuckability”.
Translation: I let myself go for so long I’ve just given up at this point.
podunk – Use the “<>” signs instead of the [ and ] signs.
Thank you.
i just like girls. except the fat ones.
haha “Woodland Park”. you are SO not in the know, dude.
are 22 year olds really hotter than 18 year olds?… i really can’t say i agree with this anymore. maybe my genes are different. the twin attraction switches in the male brain – youth and beauty – could have different levels of expression in different men.
I’ll go statistics nerd and point out that every distribution for each woman is approaching normal distribution except for the two extremes. The ugliest is completely skewed to the 1 while the hottest, Monica, is skewed almost competely to 9s and 10s. Everyone else’s distribution has a bell shaped curve with different means for each sample. While this makes perfect sense, I think there is room for further statistical analysis on the overall population distribution of 1-10 hotness.
Voodude: This is dumb. By forcing a ranking (only one can be a 9, 8, etc) you aren’t measuring what people actually think of the models.
On the contrary, I think this formulation is vastly better. It allows us to study the order into which guys place faces. The order is independent of the scale used (e.g., “the 10-point scale”).
The order is simply more informative than any arbitrary scale. It is also not susceptible to subjective monotonic transformations (for example, strict guys tending to give out less 8-to-10 ratings, versus looser guys tending to give out less 1-to-3 ratings; you really can’t compare such different scales).
In other words, although we can’t establish whether McDormand is “truly a 2″ (in some arbitrary scale), or that Alizee is “truly a 9″ (in some arbitrary scale), it’s already clear that virtually everyone preferes Alizee over McDormand. (For the nerds, you can compute a P-value to judge the statistical signifance of the ordering.)
You guys have very low standards!! Roissy included! Here’s what I think
a-> 1
b-> 0
c-> 6
d-> 7
e-> 1
f-> 4
g-> 5
h-> -10
i-> 8
j-> 2
Bellucci is not that hot. Just a big-titted, big-hipped somewhat above-average woman. What’s with everyone’s obsession with her??
I agree with Thursday. At the university I find the slightly older students usually better looking than the first year students (mostly 18-19). Teenagers have better skin, but that’s it, and curves usually get better after teenage.
And Thursday, I did the votes now and my ranking is unsurprisingly uneccentric.
On GNXP they once found a study claiming that blue-eyed men tend to have a preference for blue-eyed women while no one else has consistent preferences for anyone. The evopsych explanation would be drive towards the instinctive paternity guard: blue-eyed mother + blue-eyed father producing a brown-eyed kid = cuckolded
I gave the 10 ranking to letter (d),the fourth girl. I was beginning to fall in love with her just by seeing her pic! The red hair is beautiful,the soft features,the curvy lips,the little bit of a smile,she seems smart but NOT in a Castrated Woman way..all in all I’d love to meet her. My 9 was (g) the girl with the sexy grin who looks like Jennifer Aniston. Really striking. What I NEED is the soft,feminine curvy type face–some of these girls while fetching, are a bit horsey. Thats a no-no. The girl with the cigarette…she took your virginity,didnt she,Roissy!!!
Girl F (the one on the bridge) is not the most objectively beautiful one but she’s got an awesome girl-next-door appeal.
The only rating that matters is the rating you give yourself and if it’s a rating in comparison to anyone else it will make you miserable.
I agree with Joshrandall,
d & g are teh best.
And Alizee smokes even a younger Monica in hotness. What the hell is the point of this again?
“The reason women shouldn’t worry about it is that it’s going to happen to us all anyway. One may as well go with the flow of life and learn to value themselves for things other than their “fuckability”.”
Spoken like a truly ugly person, inside and out.
Cannon’s Canon: “My old lifting partner and I will always ask of each others’ women how big their calves are, to evaluate them as breeding stock for powerful legs.”
Does anyone else think this is the weirdest comment ever? Did Dwight Schrute start posting on random blogs?
“The girl on the bridge with the red scarf is probably punching the most above her weight class. Compare her to the other girl on the bridge in sunglasses which is a much more of a candid shot.”
I more or less agree, but she’s obviously a stylish slav of some kind, or is at least dressed like one. Compared to the American harpy with the tiara, who probably went to law school, and whose toothy idiot grin causes my balls to retract into my sack; scarf girl rules the most, even if she does look a little tired.
Ok, who are the smart-asses who migrated the scary JAP bitch up from a 5 to a 6??
NO! BAD DOG! That spot was clearly reserved for bridge girl.
I feel like the ratings were perfect earlier today after I took it, but there are more wrong answers and unjustifiable ties now.
Here are the correct answers, according to both God and science:
1) 5
2) 3
3) 9
4) 7
5) 2
6) 6
7) 8
8) 1
9) 10
10) 4
Automatic emoticons can lick my taint.
Yeah, Roissy isn’t in any of these.
And as far as the Bellucci debate goes, she is definitely attractive; I voted her the 9, but like Peter said, she’s 44 years old. Additionally, that’s a recent picture of her.
Here’s the kicker: Marceau (who i voted the 10) is 42, but the picture Roissy chose of her is at least 15 years old, because no one’s hair is so poofy anymore; the picture SCREAMS late 80s, early 90s. I’m not positive, but I think the easter egg is the fact that these pictures are from the same decade.
A younger Monica Bellucci would have taken the cake in this debate, but pitting a 44 year old against (what looks like) a barely 21 year old French girl? No contest.
The only rating that matters is the rating you give yourself
More delusional, we’re all special in our own way, female nonsense. Your rating determines the quality of mates your can attract on the sexual market. Rating yourself a 10 won’t get you a high quality man.
Thursday
No rating is the best rating, not that you’ll ever understand THAT. Most here only use half their brain, the left half, to navigate through life. Real intelligence involves both halves of the brain AND the heart. You won’t find real intelligence here. Carry on…
Sophie Marceau -10
Monica Bellucci – 9
Red head scarf girl – 8
Water bottle and shorts – 7
Red hair/black tank top – 6
Metro girl – 5
Orange jacket – 4
Crazy smile – 3
Frances – 2 (That’s just based on the rankings, I think it’s unfair to call her a 2)
Fattie – 1
Roissy says,”women who worry about aging are more likely than apathetic women to take measures that would preserve their looks for as long as possible.”
Why worry? Why not just take the information on board, and make rational decisions so that one doesn’t need to worry?
Time passes. If one survives long enough, one will get old. Certainly, everyone will eventually die.
“it is in women’s interests to be concerned about the ravages of aging on their sexual market value,”
Concerned, yes. Worried, no.
In my opinion, preparation for the inevitable beats worrying.
“and we see quite clearly by the vast multibillion dollar beauty enhancement and anti-aging industries that women are indeed making the logical decision that the most important asset they bring to the table is their youthful beauty.”
To me, it is incredibly sad that any group of people would reduce their value to something so fleeting. I guess it brings to bear the sayings about how if one despises themselves, others will readily agree.
“by their choices ye shall know them.”
Indeed.
I’m surprised how harsh you guys are on the last one, nice and meaty but unlikely to become obese, nice and curvy with above average facial beauty. 8 at least.
BTW,
Here’s a clip from Bellucci’s first film role listed on IMDB [vita coi figli]. It was 1990, so she would have been 26.
Even in the second clip, at 43, she’s still stone cold 10.
Sorry, PA, the mob has spoken.
Nearly all of those results look like they follow a rough normal distribution / bell curve, but the aggregation of data loses a lot of information.
Roissy, you should release the raw results on a per-voter basis in an anonymized CSV. I want to test the results under Condorcet, Borga count, etc. rules and do some cluster analysis.
Some researchers already did something similar with averaged and manipulated faces and online surveys. Couldn’t find the original source but someone posted the most interesting pictures and informative quotes here:
http://able2know.org/topic/123556-1
Monica Bullci is the only one I could give 8-10. The rest were just average or below to me. Now what we need is the male version of such a table so most guys can understand how women see them. This would cut down on the frustration some bar hunks feel when they are turned down by the 8-10s. It would also help the more sensitive types to stay their lane.
I’m one of the people that gave smiley girl a 7. It was done by default seeing as one ranking could only be used on one girl. I think the redhead that has the red scarf is not good looking in the least. If Smiley girl didnt have that ridiculous smile and was standing up straight she’d definitely be hotter than ugly, pudgy redhead and flip flop girl on the bridge.
I’d rank smiley girl a 5, but she was hotter than 6 other of the girls presented.
And Monica Belluci is a goddess. Even at this age.
Without any clue who you are apart from an admirer of French pseudonyms, I’m going to guess the Easter Egg is the last one, simply because the photo was taken in a D.C. Metro Station.
Roissy,
Um this whole thing is to see how and if Men rate women the same… I get that…. but what about if women vote on the pictures? Does that change anything. I’m scared this test is all kinds of fucked because if girls vote, there will be some haterade up on it.
oh by the way the easter egg… I about died laughing when I saw the pic of your mom… you’re sick man… fucking sick but funny as hell
Chic:
Monica Bullci [sic] is the only one I could give 8-10. The rest were just average or below to me.
Who cares? You’re a girl and your opinion is irrelevant.
VK:
Agreed that girls have no business voting here.
(See above)
“I’ve also avoided obese women, as fat will destroy even a 10’s facial beauty”
roissy cheated by including the heifer with the mustache. The fat is occluding her natural beauty.
With the right diet, stylist, and facial hair consultant she could transform up to a 7.. or at least a 1.3.
I gave water bottle a seven for the purpose of this survey, but she would have gotten a six from me in reality. I gave the her the edge over some others seemed friendly and relatively low maintenance, two qualities I appreciate in women. So I’ll admit that “Who I would date” played a factor.
Roissy, that can’t be Alizee the pop star, can it? If it is, why would pick the least flattering picture of her?
Virgle, if integrity wouldn’t keep women from voting in the forms, I hope that curiosity will.
Even though I’m an artist and a bit bisexual, I wouldn’t presume that my standards would be the same as men. In some ways, mine are more strict because a woman has no reproductive value to me.
So where weight wouldn’t be as big of a deal for me, overall fitness, poise, and expressions of confidence would. Red scarf girl would catch my eye on the street.
The rough looking one with the bangs and the moustache…I’d be scared if she was looking at me in a Lesbian bar, not because of the fat. She looks like she’s got issues.
If she cut her hair, worked out, and wore a bra or gentle minimizing bodice, I could see her as butch cute.
I would take red scarf out to a nice restaurant and then a walk on the beach. Afterwards, I would sit with her on a park bench and watch the sunset while we told each other stories about our families. The next day, I would call her and feel real nervous until she picked up. I would bring her flowers on our second date and take her to a live play or musical performance.
“If she cut her hair, worked out, and wore a bra or gentle minimizing bodice, I could see her as butch cute.”
Nevermind. I forgot that parody was dead.
Alizee
Some of you will wish you could change your vote to 10 after seeing this.
A bit pitchy at first, but you can turn the volume off and still enjoy.
“Alizee will also have to work really hard on keeping her weight down as she ages. She’s a chunky little thing. Not that I’d mind.”
At least she will have the benefit of a Mediterranean diet and walking lifestyle.
French girls stay thin.
– MPM
I’m not sure if this was intentional or not, but at least by my ratings there are huge gulfs of attractiveness between the 1 and the 2, between the 3 and the 4, and between the 7 and the 8. I really couldn’t call this a representative sample of each point on the 1-10 scale.
There’s also question of how you conceive of the scale. It would seem that by your scale, most women rate under a 3 (I would guess the median would be a little over 2). Your distribution approximates exponential decay (most of the population at the low end with smaller differences as you move up). While mine wouldn’t be a normal distribution by any means, it wouldn’t be as skewed as yours.
1 – 10 scale:
1. H – subhuman abomination
2. E – Eric Stolz from “Mask”
3. A – Disgusting body and smile
4. J – Frumpy McCanklestein.
5. B – Man face. (though bet she was cuter when young)
6. D – Cute enough. Would hit it.
7. F – Body looks OK. Hard to tell facial beauty with the distance from camera and the glasses. But nothing overtly terrible and I bet she she could do something with her hair and wear a sexier outfit.
8. G – Real cute. hate the haircut
9. C – Beautiful girl but not her best picture
10. I – Inspiring
Someone said “Red Scarf Girl” may be Slav?? I had her as Irish(like me). usually Irish girls are unappetizing slobs–so when I find a good one I get a little gooey inside,ya know?
If she is a Slav,tho,and she has an accent,and those Eastern Euro girls seem to like me—we he-he-hell! Batten down the hatches,boys,and full speed ahead!!! Port of call:Pussyland!!!
“I would take red scarf out to a nice restaurant and then a walk on the beach. Afterwards, I would sit with her on a park bench and watch the sunset while we told each other stories about our families. The next day, I would call her and feel real nervous until she picked up. I would bring her flowers on our second date and take her to a live play or musical performance.”
Good comment.
I would get high off Hashish and Absinthe and swoop her in a Czech Hostel.
Then go on partying.
– MPM
The only rating that matters is the rating you give yourself and if it’s a rating in comparison to anyone else it will make you miserable.
Aw Sara, do you need a hug? I can practically hear the guitarist and hippie chorus singing “Kumbaya” in the background. Or is that a song by Jewel I hear? Your lame quote is positive proof that you are either immensely FAT, or Fell-Out-of-the-Ugly-Tree-and-Hit-Every-Branch-on-the-Way-Down Ugly.
a., d. and f. all look like 6s to me. d. looks classy and feminine, while f. looks girl next doorish, but a bit tooo casual. a. looks like an obnoxious party girl.
Good examples of 7s:
Sarah McLaughlin
Allyson Hannigan
Mya
Jennifer Aniston
sara
“The only rating that matters is the rating you give yourself and if it’s a rating in comparison to anyone else it will make you miserable.”
Did you get that from Stuart Smally? You don’t seem to realize you posses a very post-modern view that “we are whatever we want to be.” Or if you just believe in yourself enough, anything is possible. This is just fantasy and flies in the face of centuries of human preferences. There may be some variation among cultures and races, but every man on the planet agrees that youth is more beautiful than age, facial symmetry is highly sought and thin preferable to obese.
The idea that beauty is objective is not new or unique to this group. The Greeks had very strict, mathematic guidelines for what constituted a beautiful face and interestingly, they found blonds rather unattractive. One could compare Greek statues to modern glamour shots – they were meant to capture the ideal not the real. The Japanese also had very strictly defined guidelines for beautiful women such as in the style of the Geisha.
Rain, it’s clear that male and female standards of beauty are different. There’s no need for us to agree with each other or argue about who is hotter.
I would love to see a male version of this, where the women vote. Masculine beauty does matter, quite a lot to women, especially now that women are more capable of supporting themselves. I think ugly guys think that they can punch above their weight because of ‘game”, but sadly, I don’t really think it is so. As black guys pay more attention to their looks and grooming, is that part of the secret of their success with the opposite sex?
Thursday — good examples of 7s although I would say Alyson Hannigan is more of a 6 since she has a goofy look to her (she’ll always be American Pie band camp girl to me).
“Good examples of 7s:
Sarah McLaughlin
Allyson Hannigan
Mya
Jennifer Aniston”
I would rate Mya way over all those girls.
I have seen her in person a bunch of times and she is fly.
Especially when you consider her body and the way she can move it.
This is why I like the 100 point scale.
– MPM
Actually in this group, counter to Roissy’s prediction, there’s remarkable consensus that Monica Bellucci, #9 from the top, is the 10. But so too the next two down, the Isabelle Adjani look alike (3 from the top) for the 9 and the Czech looking Alizee (French, no), 7th from the top, are also widely agreed. Actually I think both these last are 9s (or the Adjani like is a 10) but you’re supposed to rank order them, no, and most of us easily agreed on the order.
Also there’s near universal agreement on the bottom two and their order. Nuff said. There’s wide agreement that Francis McDormand, 2nd from the top, is our 3 here, but I think her pic is pretty unfair. She’s a three for guys prowling for twenty somethings. She’s a clear cougar if on the prowl – it’s a pic in her early forties, while the rest are in their twenties.
It seems to be the middle and slightly above, 5-7 that has the least consensus here. Also, I couldn’t find a girl that got more votes as a 5 than anything else. 10 from the top, who got most votes as a 4 (where I ranked her) comes closest, with nearly as many votes as a 5 – which is where I’d place her if I didn’t have to rank order this list. Which brings up a defect. I bet less than half but quite a lot of people ranked each girl where they thought she should place, leading to doubling up on e.g. 6’s and skipping others (such as the 5).
Anyway, the 6-7 territory seems the most contested here, and I suspect that’s true in real life. That doesn’t quite fit in with Roissy’s usual dictum, since he tends most of the time to emphasize a pretty sharp line between female 7s (the bottom of female alphas, and the lowest that male alphas, who go only down to 8 says Roissy and are maybe half as numerous overall) and 6’s.
While the top end of this group of photos chosen by Roissy makes perfect sense to me, as do the bottom two, those that fall in positions 3 to 5 or 6 surprise me. For one thing they look a lot better than where I’d place girls. I bet for example that most alpha guys who aren’t more than five years
younger than Francis, who fills spot 3 here, would definitely do her if there wasn’t anyone hotter around, she was putting out wanting it and not too bitchy signals, and he was horny. Whereas in everything else I’ve seen Roissy write, it’s just about unthinkable that an alpha would do a 3 ever. A 5 in extremis from time to time he’s said, but that’s IT. (Well in truth Francis is at 5 or 6 adjust for age I think, but if we were supposed to rank order (esp. in this mostly youngish crowd), then in competition with 20 somethings she comes in as the 3 here.
I had expected the 3 to be a decent looking (if thin) fattie and the four to be a prettier fatty. Well I guess the 4 here sorta qualifies. Here it’s only the bottom two rungs that are fatties (and ugly to boot of course).
“I would love to see a male version of this”
I wouldn’t.
Terrible idea.
Guys are horrible.
The only guy I like looking at is myself.
– MPM
“As black guys pay more attention to their looks and grooming, is that part of the secret of their success with the opposite sex?”
I think black guy’s success with women is several other factors besides looks. First, I’ll assume that black guys do have more success just based on the fact that their average number of partners is highest for all races. We do have to take into account that black dudes will pretty much bang anything though, no offense VK.
First, black guys are always on Game. by this I mean they are always spitting Game no matter the situation. They were born with their uncles and brothers spitting Game; theirs is a culture steeped in Game. Second, black dudes are more persistent in trying to get laid. They are less shy about communicating their intentions. Also, as Roissy has noted previously, black women are sluts. The real question to be answered isn’t the number of chicks black dudes pull but the quality of the lays. As to that topic, I’m not sure of the answer.
“Alizee
Some of you will wish you could change your vote to 10 after seeing this”
That video made me regret giving her an 8 instead of a 6. [but I stand by the vote as far as the picture presented is concerned] She looks like Juno. Her stumpy legs, girlish body, big head, and everything else were laughably far from 10.
It can’t be matched or displaced. It’s the fucking Tsar Bomba of femininity:
Not just how she looks, but her expressions and movement.
It’s helpful to compare those videos with more images of Sophie Marceau, who is in distant second place in votes for the 10 spot:
I need to ask this: are you guys giving (b) a low rating mostly because she’s old? Because I’ve been more or less on par with the rest of you except on this one: I think she’s reasonably attractive and the only thing I can see about her that might turn the rest of you guys off is her age. (I gave her a 6, FWIW.)
I’ve known for a long time that I have a MILF fetish; I think women are at their peak attractiveness in their late 20s and I think some women are hawt in their 30s, even 40s (they just give me that undefinable “vibe” that some of you have mentioned). So, I’m really curious to know why you guys rated her so low; whether it’s to do with her age or if you actually don’t see anything in her.
Thursday-So Agnostic has gotten to you too(Mya). I bet you were so jealous when she gave that lap dance to Carson Daily. Faith Ford isn’t bad either but she looks to have had some work done in comparison to Sarah McLaughlin. That mom haircut isn’t doing much for Ford either.
Jennifer Aniston’s body is a 9.5. I just wish she had more of a butt. I hate that she did that kiddy looking nude photo for GQ. That’s something a 20 year old should do. At 40, her nude photos should have a more mature artsy(tp) look to them.
yay this was fun!! let’s do more games!
on the real, though, it’s interesting to know that (as other commenters point out) these women basically got divided into three categories: ugly warpigs, maybe/it depends, and oh wow she’s hot. everyone seems to agree on the general category but debate position within that grouping.
wonder if it’s the same in real life??? i find it hard to imagine a guy really going – oh, she’s a 3, the girl next to her a 6, the girl behind her a 9… wouldn’t it be more like not hot, eh…, and way hot?
What’s the incentive for so many 5 and lower women to hang around this blog?
i find it hard to imagine a guy really going – oh, she’s a 3, the girl next to her a 6, the girl behind her a 9…wouldn’t it be more like not hot, eh…, and way hot?
Realistically?
“Of course I’d bang her,”
“Yeah, I’d bang her,”
“Maybe I’d bang her if I drank a six pack first and my friend’s would never find out…”
or:
“I wouldn’t bang her with your dick.”
mandyfacial symmetry is highly sought and thin preferable to obese.
Mandy, what is your idea of thin? Are you thinking runway model thin or lady with the flipflops thin.
I would argue that most men prefer women with hourglass figure like Rachael Welsh, Ursula Andreas and Betty Page for breeding. Those body types look fertile and womanly.
I need to ask this: are you guys giving (b) a low rating mostly because she’s old
Yes. McDormand was maybe a 6 at her peak.
http://www.movieactors.com/photos-stars/frances-mcdormand-bloodsimple-5.jpg
http://www.movieactors.com/photos-stars/frances-mcdormand-bloodsimple-6.jpg
I’m sure many others would say 7, since she was obviously able to get “the babe” role in movies, like Darkman, on into her 30s. Not to my approval, but there it is.
With age comes the inevitable decade by decade slide towards 1.
“What’s the incentive for so many 5 and lower women to hang around this blog?”
That question kind of answers itself, but do any of the regular barkers care to enlighten us?
I have a few parting remarks.
The grey-eyed Sophie Marceau (eyes look grey in that picture to me) is the type of vision that make 17 year olds fall so hard in love, and struggle with oneitis for a few years until 22 or so. . Older women can never make men feel like they will feel looking into a gaze like that. . Those eyes and that bone structure, that skin are perfect. Fluffy hair is feminine and looks good on her.
The red head is pretty damned attractive to be outside on a cold night and look like that in harsh camera light. Looks like she would be good to kiss also. She has very “personable” eyes and I bet she can be very facially expressive with her moods. Nice mouth too. Something about a red-head. http://www.myddnetwork.com/tech-money/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/neanderthals-and-redheads.jpg
I love that picture of a redhead. That was in an article discussing the notion that neanderthals oft had red-hair and that some of their genes must be present in redheads today. Im not claiming yea or nay on that one, dont know.
The girl on the bridge is one I should have given an extra point to. I think I rated her a 6, but she is in very harsh sunlight and her eyes (one of a woman’s best weapons) are hidden behind sunglasses. She isn’t “stacked”, but looks quite feminine.
If Mary Magnalane of Mel Gibson’s casting, Monica Belluci, is over 40 in that shot, glamor shot or no, she is an outlier of humanity in general. Catherine Denueve was this way through her 40′s and 50′s. She was still very doable way later than most women. Best hair I think I ever saw on a woman even past middle age—-no hint of grey.
BTW—-Roissy isn’t in any of these pictures.
JVM, I totally agree with you on the girl by the bridge. 7?
– Original Grace.
I think attitude and body language does play a role. Adams Morgan girl is in a miserable “don’t approach me, asshole” stance and I put her in the 5 spot. If she was friendlier (and I had a clearer look at her face), I might have put her in the 7 spot.
Frances McDormand was born in 1957. That’s the only reason for her low score.
Here’s something interesting. In her peer group when she was in her 20′s she was a 5-6. Very plain gal. But among women in her current age group, she stacks up very well. This is why women shouldn’t just throw in the towel and let themselves go when they hit 40.
No. 7 has star quality. Votes on him are the least controversial. He should try competing for the American Idol.
Rube,
Go to local 16, st. x, black cat on dance nights, chi-cha.
-original grace
I think number 4 is severely underrated. Beautiful even features and the fullness of her face indicates a wonderful body.
So the repeating sentiment here appears to be that bridge girl [the 6] and scarf girl [the 7] are the best “girlfriend material”.
Guys here keep making weird comments about dates and kisses and overlooking imperfection. Interesting reactions. Women should be happy because this suggests most men have instinctive reactions to treat women of lower attractiveness.. women slightly above average.. with the most respect and most investment.
Too much beauty = too little paternity certainty = pump and dump? Poor 8,9, and 10s.
http://akinokure.blogspot.com/2008/04/why-hot-females-get-cheated-on-more.html
David Alexander’s votes will be tabulated separately.
I’ll refrain from giving a numerical score, and simply express my thoughts thru the twisted words of a porn addict…
Girl #1: She’s pretty, but she doesn’t exude any sexuality.
Girl #2: She’s aged, and in her youth, she may have appealed to some men, but not me.
Girl #3: Cute, perfect for Agnostic, yet again, lacking in sexuality.
Girl #4: Cute with redhead, perfect for taking on a date to the museum, but not banging. READ: Female friend.
Girl #5: Not ugly, yet, not pretty. “Plain”.
Girl #6: Sunglasses are cheating.
Girl #7: Pretty, somewhat attractive to most males.
Girl #8: If she was nice, I’d pity her. If she was mean, well, she’d be the ugly girl we all make fun of for being a bitch.
Girl #9: Beautiful, some sexual appeal, but not hot.
Girl #10: “Average” with token bonus points for heels.
If she was nice, I’d pity her. If she was mean, well, she’d be the ugly girl we all make fun of for being a bitch.
Comment of the month?
There’s not enough variability in these pictures to cover the full 1 to 10 range. Almost all are above-average, or just at average, and only a few below. I discussed how we perceive these things in this way here:
http://www.gnxp.com/blog/2008/08/attractiveness-logarithmically.php
Basically, we make very fine distinctions among the above-avg people, and we hardly nitpick at all among the lower end. So, the distance between a 10 and a 9 is pretty small, hair-splitting. But the difference between 5 and 4 is much greater, and even more with 2 vs. 1.
Since this looks like we measure attractiveness on a log-scale, to get the “real” attractiveness value, we exponentiate the numbers we provide.
By the way, given that the conventional wisdom of the blogosphere is that women turn into foul skags after age 30,* it should be noted that Monica Bellucci is 44 years old.
* = 25, according to Agnostic; 20, according to Gannon.
Peter, the foul skags who read this blog are not going to suck your dick just cuz you keep inflating their egos with this balderdash.
The exception proves the rule.
Peter, the foul skags who read this blog are not going to suck your dick just cuz you keep inflating their egos with this balderdash.
Foul skags are an excellent source of hugs though.
Foul skags are an excellent source of hugs though.
thursday, correction. here is the comment of the month.
DA, third prize is… you’re fired from life!
Cigstache girl is Roissy.
Sorry! Pupu had made a counting mistake! It is girl no. 8 not no. 7! While she is competing for American Idol, Pupu will be re-taking grade school.
“Bellucci is not that hot. Just a big-titted, big-hipped somewhat above-average woman. What’s with everyone’s obsession with her??”
PA, I’m with you on that. Just doesn’t work for me.
As far as I’m concerned, the ten slot was between Alizee and Sophie. Putting aside “real life,” I’d rate both of their photos here as strong nines. Based on the photo alone, I gave Alizee the edge, though I think that overall Sophie has the prettier face. Tough call, as they each have a very different look – Alizee looks confident and in control, Sophie kind of has that Hot Chick but Nobody’s Home look. Coin toss, but Alizee won it. Besides, she looks so receptive to game in that photo, like she’s ready to roll.
It’s the borderlines that are tough, like Bridge Girl and Red Scarf girl. They have an appeal (assuming a super cool personality, which many borderlines have), but you know that if you start seeing one, you are going to get a major case of Wandering Eye. I mean, in time, we all get Wandering Eye, no matter how hot the girlfriend. But with girls like that, I get Wandering Eye on the first or second date. It kind of sucks.
You’re with this girl who’s really cool, and kinda sorta cute, but your real attention is focused on the slutty cocktail waitress. You just can’t pay full attention to the borderline. That’s the problem with dating girls in the seven range. Better to stay on solid eight ground.
Ryder, i thought you would be pissed at the lack of blondes in this post. I surprised there aren’t a few real blondes in this pool. Two redheads but no blonds.
*shrugs shoulders*
I don’t see anything beyond a 4 here…
btw, the instructions were to vote a unique rating for the women, using each point on the 1 – 10 scale only once. you’ve voted for four 1s. travesty.
Darn. I just went straight to voting.
Everyone: Monica Belluci is not French.
She’s Italian. Just saying. And quite beautiful.
rube,
“Totally off topic, but what kinds of places in DC should I look for to pick up lonely unattached drunk chicks on the 14th?”
Fly to Miami Beach.
South Beach is the best place to be in the USA on Valentines.
– MPM
Assuming I were in a bar with all 10 of these girls present, Sophie, Alizee, Monica, Red Scarf, and MAYBE Bridge Girl (in that order) are the only ones I would invest time and energy in approaching. I wish I could see Bridge Girl’s face. Her body doesn’t appear that special.
Red Scarf’s face is cute enough, but I would hope her bod is tight.
In general, a cute girl’s attractiveness goes up a half notch when she’s smoking. (Although I don’t like the smell.)
With that said, Cigarette Girl is proof that Satan is real.
Perrier Girl and Metro Girl might be better – or, for that matter, worse – than they appear in these pictures. It’s difficult to tell given the low quality of both photos.
Peter
If anyone missed it,
The very first picture (the girl bending over and smiling waaay to large) is actually a Roissy Repeat.
http://roissy.wordpress.com/2007/08/06/big-fat-phony-smile/
If someone made this comment already, whoops but I wasn’t going to bother sifting through 100+ comments to see if anyone else made the connection.
The general rule about the extremes is :
If a woman’s appearance is so bad that it actually disturbs you – to the extent you have to look away, she is a 1 or a 2. This can mean she has an ugly face, or has a decent face but is morbidly obese. At any rate, someone you would not have sex with even for a large sum of money.
If a woman’s appearance is so captivating that you find yourself staring at a picture of her, and actually save a picture of her onto your hard drive, she is a 9.5 or 10. Again, a 10 for one guy can be an 8 for a different guy, and vice-versa.
I saw a scientific experiment run where a large number of men were asked to point out which female face they rate as ‘perfect’. The results varied considerably, but a computer composite of all those faces was made, in order to generate a composite perfect face. The composite computer generated perfect face looked remarkably like Christy Turlington. Thus, one can scientifically say that Christy Turlington is the woman who would get the highest average score among a large group of voters i.e. she is the face least likely to get a subpar score. Note that this was a vote of face only, not body (not that her body is flawed, but is just not part of the scientific experiment).
So Christy Turlington (when she was under 30) was the most universally appealing beauty.
I’m on board with David Alexander’s assessment. I’d go ahead and bump #9 into the “hot” category, but that’s about it.
Anyway, there’s only so much I can glean from a face. If you look like a 12 year old boy from the neck down, then I’m taking a pass (or at most put in a half-assed effort). It’d be cool if you could repeat this gimmick, only showing the whole body, roissy.
I think I screwed up, was I suppose to use every number from 1-10. I just went down the row and voted for the number I thought. Whoops
Sophie Marceau at age 16, almost 17:
http://pro.corbis.com/search/Enlargement.aspx?CID=isg&mediauid=%7B9DA1A282-D3DE-4A78-B99B-2D01450FD43C%7D
Giggity!
Tood:
That’s a non sequitur if I’ve ever seen one. People who publish such news stories should be sent to gulag for defiling the good name of science (and if the original paper claims the same, the authors should join them, together with the peer reviewers).
Sophie Marceau at age 16, almost 17
So in other words, guys like you are why plain girls think they’re hot?
@David Alexander
“So in other words, guys like you are why plain girls think they’re hot?”
“Plain”? She looks like girl in picture #5 in other words? I don’t think so. She’s attractive.
Not hot though, I agree on that. There’s a lot of girls who’s greatest attribute is that they have no obvious deformities (decent proportions, weight, etc). But they get bumped to “hot” for no good reason.
I get the feeling this is VERY prevalent in DC…
@Rain And
“Too much beauty = too little paternity certainty = pump and dump? Poor 8,9, and 10s.”
Bullshit.
Most guys here (or anywhere else) will not get the opportunity to “pump and dump” an 8+. In fact, if one looked at them twice, they’d marry them on the spot. I’m not exaggerating either. Most guys will try to marry the first 8+ they hook up with.
That is actually the worst photo I have ever seen of Sophie Marceau.
She is a genuine 9.5 or 10, in her adult life (age 20-35). Not only are you a pedophile, but have poor taste as well, to be so turned on by her picture at that age.
“Most guys will try to marry the first 8+ they hook up with.”
I agree. The average man is totally hopeless. This is why women who are even 6s and 7s have such big egos.
A man with even moderate Game competence (as long as he is not wholly deficient in looks or career), however, can score 8s with decent regularity. This is because so many Beta men are just so clueless…
“That is actually the worst photo I have ever seen of Sophie Marceau.”
I am referring to agnostic’s link, not the photo in Roissy’s article.
agnostic–
I love Sophie Marceau’s looks. I was thoroughly prepared to be amazed by your link above. Instead I was VERY disappointed.
She looks WAY better elsewhere, and it must be, older. Early twenties.
Still, I do agree there’s a lot to be said for un or anyway less corrupted/used/jaded female souls. I think they used to be called virginal.
scyo–
Yes I remember her being posted by Roissy before.
She’s clearly, utterly obviously clearly a slut. An intelligent Jewish slut, which is the worst spieces of woman any man could ever imagine marrying.
She will, guaranteed, rake her first (at least) husband over the coals for $$ if she marries a money guy (likely). I mean visciously and mercilessly and intelligently. Sound like fun? Oh yeah it’s a type. BIG TIME.
The way a current day American woman defends against a cheating tempted American man: I’ll take your ass to the cleaners financially and leave you with next to nothing. Half you think. Haaa! That’s before the process support and lawyers (both sides) and deducts and house and all which are massive, and then there’s ongoing child support which is really mostly alimony but not tax deductible and massive, like half of your after tax. Massive. Destroy your ass. So don’t think about it.
The way a current day American man defends against a cheating tempted (as all the hot or hotish ones are now adays in this feminist culture) American wife: I’ll divorce you and take your ass to the cleaners. Wait. What? See above. (I’ll be emasculated. If you massively serially cheat on me, with no recourse but to give you most of my money with huge taxes going forward if kids.)
American marriage today for men? Are you serious?
wow, it’s interesting to see how consistent I was with most everyone else. damn monkey brain =)
Notice how I didn’t say she was hotter at 16 — obviously is better looking in the pic in the main post.
Giggity responds to absolute looks, not how a girl looks relative to her peak.
So in other words, guys like you are why plain girls think they’re hot?
Heh, nice way to project there, foul skag butt-licker.
“Sophie Marceau at age 16, almost 17:”
One more example of how almost all women don’t peak until their early 20s. A 15-17 year old is probably the female beauty equivalent of a 29-31 year old. Not bad, but not peak.
“I saw a scientific experiment run where a large number of men were asked to point out which female face they rate as ‘perfect’.”
Link?
“The composite computer generated perfect face looked remarkably like Christy Turlington. Thus, one can scientifically say that Christy Turlington is the woman who would get the highest average score among a large group of voters”
This does not follow at all. Jesus Christ. So many weird logical leaps.
“Bullshit.. Most guys will try to marry the first 8+ they hook up with.
Yes, it might just be a commentary on the relative mate value of the men making the investment statements for the 6s and 7s. Perhaps men that can reliably date 9s and 10s are more likely to make reflexive investment statements when they see pictures of 9s and 10s.
Or maybe men that can reliably date 9s and 10s make no reflexive investment statements.
Either way, it’s interesting that comments about 8s,9s, and 10s are sexual, comments about 1-5s are amused, bored, or disgusted, and comments about 6s and 7s are the most respectful and altruistic.
People want to take bridge girl and scarf girl on a “date”, no one has expressed similar wishes to invest in Bellucci or Marceau.
Chicnoir:
“Now what we need is the male version of such a table so most guys can understand how women see them. ”
I don’t give a rats ass how most women see them. Nor do most any other non ass kissing men.
Why should I?
God you can be annoying.
PA –
Monica in movies. Basically she went to movies after she’d “lost her looks” as a model, like really the hottest model out there from a hetero man point of view (which is not first fiddle in Milan and elsewhere, as you know, damn them gay boys) by aging into her thirties and then she decided to let herself put on a LITTLE weight. But her first movie is amazing re her beauty. YOung boy idolizing her as a war widow, MILF ( NO KIDDING) in early post war Italy. Too lazy to link. You’ve heard of IMDB.
Have you ever seen the few pics out there of the early twenties Sophia Loren? Incredible. Among very many other things, she had the most extreme wasp like (tiny waste, huge tits and ass) figure I’ve EVER seen, literally. Plus the most dangerous but also ultimately female submissive face I’ve ever seen. God.
A 15-17 year old is probably the female beauty equivalent of a 29-31 year old. Not bad, but not peak.
Very wrong. It’s not hard to find girls like this among 16 to 18 year-olds:
http://www.shejailbait.com/885
http://www.shejailbait.com/894
By 29, their skin is approaching the Saran-Wrap-on-a-bone look. Much less bounce to their flesh. Stuff is drooping. Wrinkles. Less lustrous hair. More masculine skull.
I’ve put up a bunch of data on my blog that as far as fuckdoll appeal goes, probably 23 is the peak. But it doesn’t fall off symmetrically — 7 years younger than 23 will still give you multiple orgasms, while 7 years older than 23 will not.
An intelligent Jewish slut, which is the worst spieces of woman any man could ever imagine marrying.
The upside is that your kids will become chosen, and blessed with high IQ to get into an Ivy League school. I’d hand over 100% of my salary to have high IQ half Jewish kids.
This is because so many Beta men are just so clueless…
No, it’s because they have the sex appeal of an orange.
Heh, nice way to project there, foul skag butt-licker.
I’m well aware of being in the low rung of the male side of the human species with an addition to porn. You on the other hand can do better than a foul skag, but if that’s what turns you on, you’re always welcome with me at the bottom.
@Rain And
“Yes, it might just be a commentary on the relative mate value of the men making the investment statements for the 6s and 7s. ”
That’s exactly it. Actually, most men would marry 7+. Most wives I see are solid 5′s and 6′s (though of course, I’ve met my share of 8s and 9s).
@David Alexander
“I’d hand over 100% of my salary to have high IQ half Jewish kids.”
Did you say you’d marry an ugly Jewish girl? Why not Asian?
(hint: the reason why jewish people “magically” do well education-wise. It’s because their culture gives a shit. Not just standout individuals. (Nearly)The whole culture…at least in the United States. Of course many end up manic depressives because of this, but that’s another point. ).
Did you say you’d marry an ugly Jewish girl? Why not Asian?
Half-Jewish kids gives me access to high verbal IQ that leads to prestigious careers with big returns back by the networking capabilities of the Jewish community. Half-Asian kids gets me an engineer with no network. In other words, the half-Jewish kid gives my last name some degree of high ranking, while the Asian kid keeps me stuck in the upper middle class at best. Yet, knowing my luck, only the scummy low IQ white girls looking for beta provider will find me remotely tolerable.
BTW, I’m not really attracted to Asian women since they tend to lack in tits and ass, and white women are generally better looking facially. OTOH, my brother has the yellow fever.
It is my wish that when the day comes where I find myself lying on my deathbed fast approaching my imminent demise, that a set of holographic goggles be placed over my eyes, projecting upon my retinas the images of that Alizee video everyone keeps re-posting, on a repeating loop, as the light of my consciousness slowly flickers away into obsolescence, in order to serve as a reminder of what makes this meaningless terror-ecstasy we call existence worth enduring.
Agnostic:
Sophie Marceau at age 16, almost 17:
http://pro.corbis.com/search/Enlargement.aspx?CID=isg&mediauid=%7B9DA1A282-D3DE-4A78-B99B-2D01450FD43C%7D
Looks-a like-a John Cusack.
P.S. If Lemmonex is still reading — I’ve got something chubby growing in my pants and it’s got your name written all over it.
@David Alexander
“Half-Jewish kids gives me access to high verbal IQ that leads to prestigious careers with big returns back by the networking capabilities of the Jewish community.”
You me your kids, not you. Your kids would have yadayadabullshityada. So you’d marry and ugly Jewish chick for this?
You’re nuts, but an interesting writer.
Anyway, what about your penis?
Anyway, what about your penis?
Lots of Viagra and jerking off in a garage in the middle of the night.
I’d still put up with the horrible life with a yenta who is incapable of loving me knowing that I sacrificed for my kids to have a solid future, and that my lineage will join the upper class. It’s still better than marrying a black girl and hoping for an professional athlete to spawn, or freaking out about her possible low IQ tainting my children even further.
Bwahaha
tokyoanalfisted
You’re already this desperate? Just give up before you embarass yourself any further.
where did I say I hated Asians?
It’s obvious that you hate them. If I had said that I like black women, hispanic women or Russian women, you wouldn’t have gone berserk.
I’m just pointing out the obvious fact that loser betas like you
As I’ve already explained, I’m neither a beta nor a loser. Perhaps you’re just projecting.
“prefer” Asian women because you don’t have it in you to be successful with an attractive white woman.
Or maybe I just prefer Asian women because I prefer Asian women. I might as well say that you “prefer” white women because you’re too much of a loser to make it with Asian women. Same thing.
Thursday
Asia? Where did I comment on Asians?
Can you even read?
Can you follow the discussion? No, I guess you can’t.
jackson
Re: Asians, If I wanted someone with the body of a 12-year-old boy, I’d date 12-year-old boys.
People keep saying this, but it doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. I guess you must be an expert on 12-year old boys or something, but Asian women don’t look like that.
It’s somewhat artificial to have such a small population to rank. Nonetheless it is interesting but not surprising the extent to which we agree in the ranking. We should for the most part agree since beauty is based on evolutionary cues that are universal.
I have to say I’d like to have seen some ethnic diversity personally though. I think this may lead to more disagreement based on some of the responses above.
In no way is dating a non-white indicative of a lack of options though for an individual who doesn’t perceive one race as inferior to another. All beautiful women are beautiful, regardless of race. There are plenty of wonderful and horrific examples from any background you wish to look at.
For instance who has the greater status, the man dating the mustachioed water buffalo we all agreed was #1 in the scale or the man who dates Jewel Santini aka Jutima Saengram, a (former) Thai. I defy anyone to deny that this girl is stunning: http://www.bmamodels.com/d.asp?id=3720&s=15&o=0&g=0&p=73
OK that picture of Sophie Marceau at 16/17 ends the debate. Teenagers are hotter.
No. How in the hell can you expect people to gauge peoples beauty when all of the photos are different? Different lighting, different professionalism, some of the girls looking away, some smiling, one wearing sunglasses…No. That is incredibly stupid, this is less of an experiment and more of a fanboy cold reading contest.
If you want many pictures of similar looking people, in similar lighting, who for the most part are nuetral try
http://www.exactitudes.com/serie.php?nr=78
Out of all of these girls
http://www.exactitudes.com/serie.php?nr=109
Which one is the prettiest?
What about these
http://www.exactitudes.com/serie.php?nr=92
Does brigth red lipstick make a difference?
http://www.exactitudes.com/serie.php?nr=110
Who is the manliest?
http://www.exactitudes.com/serie.php?nr=1
Who is the handsomest?
Try that. At lest it’s a little better.
Also why not get to the point and just write about the golden ratio?
http://www.facialbeauty.org/divineproportion.html
Quite whip cracking, this website isn’t making you money, so why not point people in the direction that will help them better understand?
Worth making a distinction between “beautiful” and “turns me on”? Maybe even agreeing that these are two different ranking-ladders that may or may not have some overlap?
In my own case, for instance: I can see that Alizee is a very pretty girl, but she doesn’t do a thing for my id or my libido. She’d be high on my list of pretty/beautiful women, but lowish on my personal “turns me on” list. I’ve known loads of guys who are very picky about female beauty, but who don’t get off sexually on the girls they’re so picky about. They get off instead (in the actual-real sense) with girls who they didn’t find so aesthetically breathtaking.
“The girl whose looks I highly approve of” and “the girl who really makes me want to lose it glandularly” … Often two different girls. Or at least that’s a real possibility, and maybe it deserves to be recognized.
And, hmm, where the “objectivity” and “beautiful” thing is concerned … I’m with it — beauty is real. But the 1-10 scale strikes me as juvenile and a pain. I’d suggest something like a 3 level scale in its place. In the top category: gals who are amazingly genetically lucky, and everyone can agree on this. (Sophie, Monica, etc.) At the bottom: gals who have been amazingly unlucky, or who have destroyed their own looks, and nearly everyone will agree on this too.
And one giant category in between: loads of gals who are perfectly OK looking and whose perceived attractiveness depends to a great extent on the perceiver. One guy might find a particular mid-range gal plain while another might perfectly plausibly find her delightfully cute.
It seems to me that such a scale would be a fairly easy one for most people to agree on. Not so much fun to argue about, though.
http://i43.tinypic.com/2cpokyr.jpg
Is there any doubt that this guy is an ardent Roissy follower?
“hint: the reason why jewish people “magically” do well education-wise. It’s because their culture gives a shit. Not just standout individuals. ”
Indeed. There is nothing magical. Chinese and Indians outperform even Jews, plus they are not plotting divorce all the time either.
Is there any doubt that this guy is an ardent Roissy follower?
No, an “ardent Roissy follower” probably wouldn’t fanatically support the NDP, for starters.
BTW, “Nihonese” is just a linguistic abomination.
While black men have a lot of natural game, in my experience, they are wholly incompetent at judging female beauty. A woman of notably homeliness or substantial obesity will often be judged as ‘fine’ by a black man. They truly will ‘do anything’.
A – 5
B – 4
C – 9
D – 7
E – 2
F – 6
G – 8
H – 1
I – 10
J – 3
Really difficult deciding between 9 and 8 – I had to mull it over because 8′s photo grabbed me more than 9′s, but 9 is more feminine
6 beats 5 on body – its hard to tell cuteness with the shades, but there could be something there and compared to that ridiculous expression on 5′s face…
4, 3 and 2 are tough – 4 looks to be the prettiest (if I can even use that word to describe her), but unfortunately also the oldest so her shelf-life is expiring fast. 3 beats 2 on youth, but there is the potential for 2 to upgrade her cuteness factor
UB
None of these girls are a “10″.
It seems that all guys can pretty much agree on who is in the bottom half of the female looks distribution. It’s from 6 to 9 that it gets tricky. I was on the high end or on the low end for many of my picks. If a 6 is “doable” for most men, then this makes some sense, at least to me. After she meets a minimum threshold (which certainly is not that low), I judge and care more about other characteristics.
I find that I have somewhat different tastes than my friends. I like women that are pretty tall, not that girly, and with nice asses over the short girly types many of my friends like.
And yes, I am one of the ones that fucked with (h) a bit giving her a 10.
Liberals, feminists, enabling betas, etc.. rejoice. You’ve won:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090212/ap_on_re_us/octuplets
Enjoy things while you can. It won’t be too long now…
Nicolas Sarkozy’s superalpha seduction of Carla, finally revealed:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/4600514/Nicolas-Sarkozy-asked-Carla-Bruni-to-marry-him-minutes-after-meeting-her.html
super-direct us-versus-them cold read.
I’m stuck in this mode right now… hung up on my first 9 instead of my usual keeping the pimp hand strong with 6s, 7s, and the occasional 8. I need to cut her off before spring time and sundresses show up again.
David,
There is no such thing as half-Jewish. If you marry a Jewish woman, you will have Jewish kids. If a Jewish man marries a shiksa, he will have gentile children.
Chic
There is some variation for body type preference, but comparing obese to in shape, a little over or under weight, men will choose not obese of some flavor.
I’m interested to hear Roissy’s take on the Chris Brown/Rhianna thing.
Here’s a guy, who from the reports has been beating this woman severely mutliple times, enough to knock her out.
In contrast to the typical feminist sob story of a poor, ugly, stupid woman dependent on her man for sustenance and her children’s lives.
In contrast: Rhianna is a very wealthy, good looking, seemingly smart, famous young woman with absolutely no dependence on Brown for her livelihood.
Yet after reportedly being CHOKED OUT and beaten TO A PULP several times, she still went back to him.
I think this shows something about how abuse is portrayed in the media versus real life, and also says something about Rhianna’s morality, as well as alphaness in general, considering that she stayed with him. I mean, she could have found a guy WHO DIDN’T BEAT HER, and had all the other parts of her relationship–I’m sure there’s a famous music dude not into hitting chicks.
But she wants this guy, probably because he’s alpha, even if (or chillingly, perhaps because) he beats her. And she prefers scummy alphas to nice guys, as I suspect many women would.
I used to have tremendous sympathy for women in abusive relationships, until I actually met a few. I saw that many of them were not trapped in these worlds and were not the “poor abused woman”, but deliberately chose the alpha who beat them over the nice guys who sought them out; the abused women wanted the bad alphas and chose them deliberately. The later hospital visits encouraged their victim hood, and several prosecuted, but they always ran back to an abuser.
Sad to say that one fo the bedrocks of my beliefs was shaken by my actual experiences with women. Roissy’s words ring more and more true every day.
marries a shiksa, he will have gentile children.
Interesting fact: “shiksa” is a Yiddish slur on gentile women, roughly translated as “smelling of piss.”
mandy, you can be Jewish ethnically though not Jewish religiously. The problem is Judaism attempts to meld ethnicity and religion together, which is a deliberate confusion in many cases.
I would prefer using the term “Israeli” to term Jtraditional ewish Ethnicity, but : 1) Jews would reject this, as it divides ethnicity from religion; and 2) Palestinians/others would get pissed at acknowledging Israel as an actual place.
Perhaps Semetic as an ethnic term? Another? Otherwise, you can be both half-Jewish and not Jewish all at the same time.
The Jewish Mother/Jewish Father distinction is a function of rabbinical law, not of real-world DNA mixing.
I’m interested to hear Roissy’s take on the Chris Brown/Rhianna thing.
Yeah, I remember when Camille Paglia back in the early 90s at the peak of feminism’s militancy, said that the reason battered women stay with their abusers is because “the sex is so hot.”
Paglia is nutty in a lot of ways, mainly because she’s trying to reconcile her working class ethnic-white sensibilities with her desire to be seen as a progressive. That notwithstanding, she gets the credit for sticking a long knife into the underbelly of feminism, intellectually speaking.
I’ll grant that there are violent batterers out there, per feminism’s narrative. But in our society, I think they are extremely rare. And probably more like shown in “Dolores Claiborne” than in “Sleeping with the Enemy.”
The “battered wife” syndrome is likely in large part a lesbian fantasy about rescuing a pretty helpless young thing from a horrible man. Betas also harbor a version of that fantasy.
I used to have tremendous sympathy for women in abusive relationships, until I actually met a few.
Once you realize that women are only attracted to alpha males, you tend to have sympathy for the women who are addicted to alpha males who beat them. It’s no different then trying to get somebody off drugs or alcohol abuse or any other addiction.
In the case of Rhianna, given that she’s already a celebrity, she’s stuck with a bunch of alpha males as the only males she’d tolerate as a potential partner, and if she stays in the narrow range of black celebrities, she may be stuck with guy given their environments and stereotypes who reek of wifebeater traits.
PA,
It is rather a derogatory term, some might say “anti-gentile” even. I’ve been told it has the connotation of whore as well.
lurker,
I prefer to use “Hebrew,” the original name for the people/ethnic group. But I understand your point. Some Palestinians are Israeli citizens, although only treated as second class one by the state. Having Jewish only roads and towns doesn’t make them feel so at home.
This concept of being Jewish via the mother comes from the Talmud, I think, because the Torah does not specify this law. Jews who do not consider the Talmud authoritative (there are a some) may recognize patrilinear(sp?) descent as well. I could go on about this book and the role of gentiles as beasts of burden in it but I ought to stop now.
Jews are one of the few “ethnic groups” one can join by conversion.
Worth making a distinction between “beautiful” and “turns me on”?
Yes, there is a distinction. But for most men the overlap is so large that we don’t expend much effort distinguishing the two.
In my own case, for instance: I can see that Alizee is a very pretty girl, but she doesn’t do a thing for my id or my libido.
Did your watch that La Isla Bonita video, not just look at Roissy’s picture?
“The girl whose looks I highly approve of” and “the girl who really makes me want to lose it glandularly” … Often two different girls.
A good example of this is sisters Haley and Hillary Duff. Hillary is clearly the prettier girl, with exquisitely fine, delicate features, but she still comes off as childish and asexual. Her slightly horsefaced sister, on the other hand, has a vibe that says do me do me do me.
But the 1-10 scale strikes me as juvenile and a pain. I’d suggest something like a 3 level scale in its place.
A difference that doesn’t make a difference, except for the worse. The 3 point scale is just a cruder version of the 10 point. There is a rising thermometer of how much pleasure we get from a girl’s looks. The 10 point scale is just a way of putting that thermometer into words, without getting too finicky. As such it reflects a reality in our minds and anything that helps us describe reality is, to my mind, a good thing. Finer scales such as the “100 point scale” seem to add little value. After all what really is the difference between a 93 and a 94. Really.
PA:
“Betas also harbor a version of that fantasy.”
As if on cue, David Alexander said:
“Once you realize that women are only attracted to alpha males, you tend to have sympathy for the women who are addicted to alpha males who beat them. It’s no different then trying to get somebody off drugs or alcohol abuse or any other addiction.”
—keep dreaming, beta boy.
RE: Red Scarf Girl
A few of the others I would pick first for a one night stand or a short fling. However, red scarf girl just looks like she would be better to spend time with.
Unlike Roissy, I cannot stomach inane women for long periods of time, which is why I struck out in DC. California is much better, but God I miss Atlanta and North Carolina.
Saw Francis McDormand in public a year or so ago. The photo does not do her justice.
Jews are one of the few “ethnic groups” one can join by conversion.
Possibly the only one. Converting to Christianity or Islam or Buddhism or another religion wouldn’t count, as those entities aren’t considered ethnic groups as distinct from religions. I’m not sure about Mormonism, perhpas that might qualify as a “dual conversion.”
In the United States, you can “convert” to being black if you discover some black ancestry in your family tree. That’s not as unlikely as it sounds, as many (supposed) white people, especially in the South, indeed have tiny amounts of black ancestry from distant generations. Discovering that ancestry would be complicated, I would imagine.
Peter
I don’t know anything about the Rihanna story myself, but I do that y’all are overlooking one important element in it: she’s a celebrity. Celebrity/performer gals have their own set of dramas and neuroses, somewhat distinct from normal life as the rest of us know it. They also have a loooonnnngggg history of tending to get involved with brutal guys.
Why this may seems to be so has been speculated about for ages and ages. Do they feel guilty? Do they feel they deserve punishment for their success? Are brutes the only guys who will approach them and who they can respect? Etc Etc.
Takeaway lesson: Stars are interesting and fun to follow. But it’s often a lousy idea to try to derive useful real-life-lessons from their adventures.
Michael, in my opinion, stars/celebrities are people just like anybody else, just in a high visibility job. They keep working even after they hit it big and their contract is over, because they enjoy their work.
It puts them in the position of being a kind of role model, but it’s not really their job to be a role model. It’s their job to entertain.
So I try to just stay away from the gossip (or stay out of the gossip in some cases) and enjoy the show.
Paglia’s strength/weakness is that she is unafraid to reveal her gut instinct on issues–she just blurts out what she feels, with no editor.
This works well for subjects of which she has knowledge–e.g. media treatment of Sarah Palin—but on other issues on which she is blind, she looks like a fool—e.g. her take on Terrell Owens. Hence why she can assert ” the sex is hot;” instinctually, she feels that, though she knows its “wrong” by the standards of society.
Yet also, contradictorily, she overanalyzes things at time. That’s a function of her wanna-be-pc nature, whcih I think is informed solely by her lesbianism; when she was a young lesbian, and lesbians were not accepted, the only group acepting her were the pc-left-wingers. So she feels beholden to them, and adopted their habits and thoughts, but her grassroots, immigrant nature brings her back down to earth—hence her contradiction with being pro-abortion (pc-leftist) but believing that pro-life women (working class imigrant) are the future of intellectual women’s thought.
Then again, it coudl be because she is Italian, and Italians are all screwed up.
Rhianna is a bitch who chose her own destiny. Let her wallow with the abusers. I hope Brown gets out with no jail time.
Michael:
“I’ve known loads of guys who are very picky about female beauty, but who don’t get off sexually on the girls they’re so picky about. They get off instead (in the actual-real sense) with girls who they didn’t find so aesthetically breathtaking.”
Interesting to hear you say that as I was just having a conversation about something similar the other day. I’ve fallen victim to this to some degree as well. For a while there, the women I actually viewed as dating material that I “liked”, I couldn’t seal the deal with. With women that I was using just for the sex, I could get off with ease.
I came to the conclusion that porn plays a big role in this. Lots of men in my generation have been conditioned to achieve orgasm in completely unintimate situations. So many orgasms were achieved while watching pictures on a screen. When having sex with someone you *actually* like, a whole new set of receptors, besides the physically stimulated ones, are being activated. It’s a feeling some guys, who’ve only known sex to be a completely lustful endeavor, maybe aren’t capable of handling.
As for getting off with less-than-breathtaking women, this has to come from a sense of insecurity. With a less attractvie woman, there is less pressure to perform which makes it easier to bust a nut.
Michael, one thing you have to remember about actresses/singers/ showbiz types is that they are incredibly insecure. No one needs the kind of validation of personal worth they need—that’s why they become “stars.” It’s about feeding their self-esteem through applause.
Many learn to put up a bitch front to this, to hide their insecurity to prevent exploitation. Ironically, this means that only players and people who truly know how to exploit people penetrate. Either that, or other insecure types become their mates. It’s a recipe for abuse/drug abuse/multiple divorces/suicide attempts/drama.
Rhianna sought an abuser to validate herself—his “protective” nature would “protect” her from her insecurity. Plus she self-loathes, so his beating her is justified. Much like a normal woman likes being “neg’ed” because of deep-seated insecurity that makes her hate herself; anyone who puts her down sees her for who she really thinks she is, and she needs to “overcome” him to prove herself worthy.
“Rhianna is a bitch who chose her own destiny. Let her wallow with the abusers. I hope Brown gets out with no jail time.”
Apparently, Chris ben beetin’ on dat Rhianna fo’ some time…Now, Puffy Combs, Puff Daddy, Diddy or whatever that clown calls hizzself threatened Chris Brown. Just typical ghetto shit from the usual suspects. Nothing new.
http://i43.tinypic.com/2cpokyr.jpg
Is there any doubt that this guy is an ardent Roissy follower?
Thanks man. I laughed until I cried. You made my day for posting this.
Is that tinypic safe for work?
I’m about as scared of Sean Combs as I am of loudest guy at a bar. As in, not at all; the more he talks, the more of a pussy he is.
Sean Combs is the Donald Trump of the hip-hop world. All flash, but no real talent and with much less money than he brags about.
[…] 12, 2009 by roissy The results are in from yesterday’s post where I asked the readers to rank the beauty of ten randomly […]
Kthuluh
Michael, in my opinion, stars/celebrities are people just like anybody else, just in a high visibility job.
Then you haven’t met many stars! Star-hood happens to very few normal-range people. Most people who become stars have near-insane levels of neediness and drive. They’re such peculiar creatures that it’s hilarious that so many normal-range people identify with them, and think they see themselves reflected in them.
Lurker
Michael, one thing you have to remember about actresses/singers/ showbiz types is that they are incredibly insecure.
Yeah, that’s one of the more plausible reasons people come up with for why female stars so often seem to hook up with brutal guys.
Thursday
Worth making a distinction between “beautiful” and “turns me on”?
Yes, there is a distinction. But for most men the overlap is so large that we don’t expend much effort distinguishing the two.
YMMV. In my experience it been pretty common that there’s a distinction for many people between “What I approve of” and “What gets me off.”
Another example: It’s one of the more common traps people fall into where cultural questions are concerned. People will give awards to literary fiction no one really likes (but everyone finds impressive), but they’ll often really really love reading celeb bios.
To me that’s directly analogous to “the girl everyone agrees is very very pretty” vs. “the girl whose looks are maybe tackier, or cruder, or quirkier, or imperfect, but who I personally (or you personally) find much, much hotter.”
Thursday
Did your watch that La Isla Bonita video, not just look at Roissy’s picture?
Sure. I’ve watched a number of Alizee’s vids. Remarkably pretty, does nothing for me.
Thursday
But the 1-10 scale strikes me as juvenile and a pain. I’d suggest something like a 3 level scale in its place.
A difference that doesn’t make a difference, except for the worse. The 3 point scale is just a cruder version of the 10 point.
No, it’s qualitatively different. It allows for both the objectivity and subjectivity part of the beauty experience.
The “beauty” and “ugly” outliers are groups that nearly everyone can agree on. That’s as objective as culture gets.
The central group is where subjectivity enters heavily in. A girl you find cute and appealing might well do zip for me, and vice versa. Objectively everyone can agree that these girls are passable-enough. Subjectively … well, it’s up to you.
So why not just skip the dopey arguments over whether she’s a 5 or a 6 and just agree that she’s passable-enough, and whether or not she works for you is, y’know, up to you?
Tupac–you are so charming.
Reading this blog has made me realize that men are by and large doing this type of very important mental calculation when they check me out. I have an urge sometimes to go up to them to point out a few flaws they may not have noticed. At the end of it, I’m sure my rating would go from whatever to goose egg, at which point I’d be satisfied that I’d done my best at full disclosure. The thing roissy doesn’t seem to get is many older women like myself who’ve had quite a bit of youthful sexual experience are decidedly NOT suffering (as he loves to believe) from a lack of advances from young men. I can’t imagine anything worse than actually having sex with one of them.
My work has put me in the vicinity of many young men lately, and there are those who insist they want me, at which point I want to step out into a bright light and point out the downside. There are some exceptions of course, but why take chances that big for what?
Here kitty…… ^_^
Is that tinypic safe for work?
It’s a screen capture of a craigslist personal. It’s perfectly safe for work. Provided the sound of your laughter won’t get you fired.
roissy,
You had a “fling” with bridge girl and put her pic up here? What class. If I were her I’d go back to the bridge and jump off, not that she didn’t want to by the time you were done with her. *stretch*
nearly everyone can agree on.
Nah, there are always border skirmishes often just as vehement as those between whether someone is a 5 or a 6, because the “certainty” you talk about is a sliding scale. The closer to the absolute top or bottom the more certainty there is. So, this pretty much solves nothing.
Besides the aggregate rankings match up pretty damn close to what connoisseurs of female beauty like me and Roissy like, even in the middle of the pack. When the aesthetes and the mob agree it’s because there is some there there.
BTW when are you going to give us your thoughts on PUA lit: The Game, The Mystery Method, The Art of Seduction. I await eagerly. Be sure to include your own recommendations for erotic/seduction/courtship lit. Have your read Scruton’s book on Sexual Desire? I am curious.
You had a “fling” with bridge girl and put her pic up here? What class.
He may have done it with her permission if they are still on friendly terms. She may have been curious about her hotness so long as her face isn’t too clearly shown.
If I were her I’d go back to the bridge and jump off
Ouch! have you ever been to that bridge? It’s rushing water about a foot deep and rocks!
“The thing roissy doesn’t seem to get is many older women like myself who’ve had quite a bit of youthful sexual experience are decidedly NOT suffering (as he loves to believe) from a lack of advances from young men.”
I’ve never seen anyone here claim that older women are suffering from a lack of willing sexual partners. Roissy and others routinely discuss how some men jump at anything female so that fact that younger men come on to you isn’t really impressive. Rather, older, uncommitted women with a past suffer from a lack of meaningful relationships with men. I think this explains the concern you have for what Roissy thinks about you in the first place – not his lack of willingness to jump your bones.
It is not in women’s nature to be fulfilled in the same way as men by one night stands. Being pumped and dumped is almost a universally painful experience for women. If you are one who finds this preferable to a committed man, you are an outlier and probably have higher testosterone levels than most women.
It is also simple biology that men are more attracted to younger women than older if they have the choice – except for a few outliers. I’m guessing that the ones who come onto you are in an environment where more attractive young women are not present. Perhaps you work in juvenile hall?
“An intelligent Jewish slut, which is the worst spieces of woman any man could ever imagine marrying.
The upside is that your kids will become chosen, and blessed with high IQ to get into an Ivy League school. I’d hand over 100% of my salary to have high IQ half Jewish kids.”
DA, trust me, it ain’t worth it.
Fabian
Your lame quote is positive proof that you are either immensely FAT, or Fell-Out-of-the-Ugly-Tree-and-Hit-Every-Branch-on-the-Way-Down Ugly.
Wrong Fabian, my love, but if it makes you feel better….
Mandy
You don’t seem to realize you posses a very post-modern view that “we are whatever we want to be.” Or if you just believe in yourself enough, anything is possible. This is just fantasy and flies in the face of centuries of human preferences. There may be some variation among cultures and races, but every man on the planet agrees that youth is more beautiful than age, facial symmetry is highly sought and thin preferable to obese.
No one is arguing with that, Mandy my dear. I’m simply stumped, horrified and shocked that no one here gets what I’m saying. Perhaps it’s too simple. We attract based on our view of self, period. And I mean our real view of self, not Stuart Smalley wishful thinking or the result of mindless affirmations. Oh never mind! I’m way too lazy to try that hard to explain.
PA
He may have done it with her permission
You’re too kind!
Michael, no I haven’t met many of them, but the kind of personality you’re describing isn’t so abnormal. Most people need what I would view as insane levels of validation, and very few are truly independent thinkers. It’s no different with celebrities.
I would venture though, that being different will be helpful to a person who wishes to be well known though.
For the most part however, actors, artists, and musicians who make it big are still the same people they were when they were struggling, or just breaking even, or doing fairly okay at it. It’s just that they have the eye of the media on them now, so what would be their personal dramas become viewed as everybody’s business.
Politicians and activists are something else. On the arts end of the celebrity spectrum though, I wouldn’t say they were truly more needy than average.
btw, Sophie Moreau (who yeah I have long thought looks a bit like Isabelle Adjani at similar ages) is a clear 10. She’s just a lower ten than the incredible Monica (esp. in her twenties as here).
Kthulah –
On the arts end of the celebrity spectrum though, I wouldn’t say they were truly more needy than average.
We’ll have to agree to disagree about that.
Sean Combs is the Donald Trump of the hip-hop world. All flash, but no real talent and with much less money than he brags about.
Umm…yeah. He just regularly makes Forbes lists annually but doesn’t really have that much dough. Because you have better research abilities than Forbes staff. Or more likely, because you wish it to be so.
Feministing must have linked to this site, that’s the only explanation I can come up with for H getting 33 10s.
Tupac–you are so charming.
Thanks Lem, but honestly, it doesn’t come easy for me. It’s hard. Very…hard.
Check out the smirk on bridge girl; roissy’s perfect counterpart.
Sophie needs to do something about her stringy hair. It’s the first thing I noticed. Looks like it needs a good wash and cut. Ugh.
sara I – The thing roissy doesn’t seem to get is many older women like myself who’ve had quite a bit of youthful sexual experience are decidedly NOT suffering (as he loves to believe) from a lack of advances from young men. I can’t imagine anything worse than actually having sex with one of them.
Older women love to brag about how younger guys wont leave them alone. And then they’ll claim they just have to reject these guys because they’re just too young and foolish.
It’s a classic display of delusional womanthink.
Willard
If it makes you feel better…..
Wondering what you’d all make of this (morphed composite images of each point on the 1-10 scale from Hot or Not samples):
http://www.flickr.com/photos/pierre_tourigny/146532556/
GNPs are for Apes – While black men have a lot of natural game, in my experience, they are wholly incompetent at judging female beauty. A woman of notably homeliness or substantial obesity will often be judged as ‘fine’ by a black man. They truly will ‘do anything’.
This black guy did OK in the finding a fine White girl department:
http://picasaweb.google.com/JAThemelis
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=88302496
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=178652568
Willard
Older women love to brag about how younger guys wont leave them alone
My comment was that many older women do not suffer from a lack of attention from young men. If you read that statement again, you’ll realize it can be taken two ways. In other words I’m not suffering because of a lack of attention from young men. They don’t pay much attention to me, and I do not (I repeat do not) suffer because of it. The few who do approach me seem quite intent and sincere; but who knows? I don’t and I don’t want to find out either.
You know, I gotta say something about this notion that Brothas have got the lock on bangin’ fat and/or ugly gals.
While its certainly true that they *do*, I think I can provide anyone who wants it some powerful evidence that they aint the only ones. Go to any mall or better yet, Walmart and there you will see nothing but White dudes w/their very portly wifeys. In a country where the *average* dress size is what a 14?, trust me when I tell ya Brothas aint the only ones doing larger gals.
Going back and reading the Bakos thread, etc, one gets the distinct impression that there’s something else going on than merely Black guys getting it on with White gals in the minds of at least some White Men. Even if said White gal was “fine” per their definition, educated, etc et al, she’s still written off as damaged goods by said White guys, even if the Black guy she was with had more education and attendant success than said White guys did.
I chalk it up to White Male Sexual Insecurity.
And on some levels, its completely understandable. What I don’t like is all the tapdancing around this simple fact.
O
Anon 5:33 a.m. is yours truly. Reset Safari, ya know.
Anyone seen Roosh’s scale?
http://www.rooshv.com/2007/the-1-10-scale
I also think, like some others above, that the scale should be linear… On my scale, for example, brigde girl is a solid 7 – that is, I think going down the street you will likely see 7 out of 10 girls uglier than her, and 2 out of 10 prettier than her.
Willard
Older women love to brag about how younger guys wont leave them alone
Well Madonna is sure having a nice time with her baby Jesus(hey Zeus). She is as old as his grandmother. She is a trick and I’m pretty sure she knows it but then again her aura and personality may have won him over. Same thing can be said of portly 40 and 50′s old with 20 year old 10′s most likely a trick but maybe there is something special about the guy.
*wonders if 20-30 years from now I will trick after a 21 year old ten*
[…] Canon tells us how he rates women on the fuckability scale: The one redeeming quality about the DC slut machine is that she seems to show some moderate calf […]
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[…] female photos (and a few of my own choices) whose rankings are less clear cut than in the previous female beauty post. I’ve also included other races, and I’ve avoided using celebrities or otherwise […]
[…] scale, and firmer agreement at the bottom end. This was intentional. In the first installment of “Female Beauty 1 To 10″ I stacked the deck in favor of strong contenders for the 8, 9, and 10 spots by using such world […]
No DDs, no bubble butts and no tans means none of these women score higher than a 7 for me.
[…] Cig burns (Only the baddest of badboys would dare cross the mafia. Or cigstache.) […]
really interesting article…didn’t knew I could find out so much with a simple click… blogging rules….nice job
Only weeaboo anime freaks aka wapanese and otaku think asian women are somehow better than white women…lol freaks.
Am I the only one who sees the LACK of diversity here? A bunch of caucasian women from size two to size fourteen, diverse indeed.
Helloooooooooo bodies are more important than faces. Bodies often indicate hard work and dedication while faces are just sitting on genes and make up.
#3 is a myspace-angle SIF for all I know.
I thought this was pretty interesting… I got pretty much all the answers “right” and I’m a straight female! It would be fascinating to repeat this under more laboratory conditions (i.e. shots from 10 non-celebrity women, same angle and background, face only, no smiles)…I personally think Monica Belluci has the most beautiful face I have ever seen, but I’m sure you can find at least a few 10s in most college campuses. So, one of you psych grad students out there should try!
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I agree with the 1-10 rating scale when assessing someone’s appearance, although the old saying: “Pretty is in the eye of the beholder, but beauty is in the soul” is true. Basically it depends on someone’s opinion, although if you happen to know them personally, you become biased, especially if they are a good person. I think that personality tends to outweigh appearance a little bit. is my opinion on the judged photos…..
8th photo is a 1
2nd photo is a 2
5th photo is a 3
10th photo is a 4
1st photo is a 5
6th photo is a 6
4th photo is a 7
3rd photo is an 8
7th photo is a 9
9th photo is a 10
[…] an absolute. There is no Uglitopia where Rachel McAdams could go that would make her look ugly and Cigstache look good. Brad Pitt, no matter how bored he gets fucking the same 10 over and over, will always […]
1: Freak like, bad vibe. She is a 3.
2: Plain face with a butch vibe. She is a 5.
3: Beautiful young woman. She is a 9.
4: Average looking red-head, pleasant features. She’s a 6.
5: lol – She’s a 1.
6: Nice enough features even though we can’t see her face,
average brests, knobby knees, flip-flops are a turn-off,
her daddy isn’t a professional. She’s a 4.
7: Pretty face, nice features, her eyes reveal nothing.
She’s a 5.
8: lol. She’s a 1.
9: Stunningly beautiful features, especially her nose and
her mouth. Gorgeous face. She’s a 10.
10: Plain as she can be and not the “interesting plain” of the girl in photo #2. She’s a 3.
Some of y’all have low standards…
1: 4. Looks pretty average although she seems annoying.
2: 3. But to be fair, she was more attractive when younger, plus this is a pretty bad pic of her.
3: 9. She has no facial flaws whatsoever plus really nice hair.
4: 5. Ew…Something about her I don’t like. This girl looks completely mousy. How the heck did people rate her a 7 on average?
5: 2. Weird face.
6: 7. Even though it’s blurry pic, she has a nice enough body and face.
7: 8. Pretty face although the hair-cut sucks bad.
8: 1. ugh.
9: 10. Perfect.
10: 5. Looks like the average american female.
Google up the youtube clip pf Cherrl Crow and W. Nelson doing “If I were a Carpenter.”
He is about 74 and she is about 29 years old.
Careful observers will notice her abundant and out-of-control pussy-juices cascading down her inner- thighs & filling up her fcm shoes.
The whole thing speaks for itself.
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There are lots of different ways to characterize the scale but the scale itself is objective in terms of the stability of individual mens’ responses to each number though subjective in terms of varying tastes/standards.
1=monstrous 2=hideous 3=ugly 4=homely 5=plain 6=okay 7=nice 8=hot 9=stunning 10=goddess
1 you can’t stand to be in the same room with, 2 you can’t look at, 3 is unpleasant but tolerable, 4 can be acceptable with a great personality or connection with you, 5 can be attractive if you are drunk or are already friends with her, 6 is datable/bangable, 7 is girlfriend material, you might cheat with an 8 if she pursued you, you might pursue a 9 to cheat with her, you would ruin your life to pursue a 10.
Monica Bellucci is to me THE most beautiful woman on earth. I’m a girl btw and not a lesbian
But I love her. She’s the perfect beauty, and the only one I know about that I would rank a 10. Because 10 is perfect, flawless! There are a lot of pretty girls out there, but very few 10′s! The prettiest girl I know is somewhere between 8 and 9.
I think I would rank myself a 5 or 6, but dressed up I could maybe be a 7…
1=monstrous 2=hideous 3=ugly 4=homely 5=plain 6=okay 7=nice 8=hot 9=stunning 10=goddess
Here’s how I do it (and have said so before a number of times) in the ways people esp. men actually talk. But also men to women, and not just men being barnyard:
1=frankly ugly;
2=pretty ugly;
3=unattractive;
4=plain;
5=ok, average;
6=cute;
7=pretty, very cute;
8=very pretty, beautiful;
9=gorgeous, very beautiful;
10=world class beauty
Here is an Indian 10:
http://photos.i.xihalife.com/u/0/0/11/uploads/532/19228068447f8e3743a1bf.jpg
Another image of the same girl
http://heartbrokedaily.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/most-beautiful-indian-woman.jpg
Funniest thread ever.
The first one gets extra props for me by being a beer drinker.
a)4
b)3
c)8
d)5
e)2
f)7?
g)9
h)1
i) 10
j)6
f) is hard to see, but from the body at least you can assume she fits between c and j
Knowing who g is… I’m tempted to rate her 10, but I just went with my first instincts when looking at the pics on the page.